House Banks & Banking Committee, February 2, 2026 Video: https://vimeo.com/1159344079 (a timestamp t plays at https://vimeo.com/1159344079#t=s) Page: https://georgiacommons.org/meetings/2026-02-02/house-banks-and-banking This is a machine transcript of the General Assembly's video, made by a speech-recognition model. It is not an official record and can mishear words, names, and numbers. Speakers are not identified. The video is the record: every timestamp links to the moment it plays. [0:14:58] Good morning. Good morning, every- good morn- good morning, everybody. Glad to see you all on this bright Monday morning. About 28 degrees, and, um, everybody's feeling good, and get this week started. I called on, um, Representative Demetrius Douglas to, um, offer an invocation before we start this morning. [0:15:19] Okay. Everybody present and ready. Father, hence, Father God, thank you for this time of fellowship. Thank you for activity of our limbs, the faculty of our minds, and the ability to make a sound decision. Thank you for traveling mercies here and home as we leave this place. Uh, thank each and every one of you guys, families that's represented here today. Let your families be as they were when you left and as you return. In Jesus' name we pray, amen. [0:15:48] Amen. Amen. Thank you, Representative. Um, I know we all are starting to get in that season where we need to be in two or three places at one time. Um, and at this time I'd like to call on Chairman, uh, Bruce Williamson if he would like to go over the, the housekeeping bill, LC number 620310S. It's a substitute bill. [0:16:15] Can you hear me? [0:16:16] Yes. [0:16:17] Uh, thank you, Chairman Williams. I appreciate it, and thank you. Um, this is, uh, this is the Georgia Department of Banking and Finance annual housekeeping bill. Um, it... And for the first time in, in my memory, we're starting off with a committee substitute, and I believe you just read it, but it's LC620310S. [0:16:39] Yes, sir. We wanted to make sure everything was correct. [0:16:41] Yeah, all right. Wanted, for the record. Uh, this is the annual housekeeping bill. It touches all of the regulated industries in which the Georgia Department of Banking and Finance regulates. It's everything from our credit unions, our banks, our money transmitters, our, um, uh, mortgage lenders, um, brokers, money transmitters, check cashiers, and, uh, now, uh, due to the, um, uh, tort reform legislation last year, the litigation financer- financiers are, uh, gonna be, uh, required to be licensed annually. [0:17:16] But it does come for the, with the support of all the, uh, like the Georgia Bankers Association, the Community Bankers Association, Georgia Credit Union Affiliates, the Mortgage Bankers Association of Georgia, Georgia Financial Services Association, the Georgia Installment Lenders Association, and the Alliance for Responsible Consumer Legal Funding, which is, again, one of these, um, litigation, uh, financing organizations. And on your desk you will find letters of support from the credit, uh, Georgia Credit Union Association, as well as the National Insurance Crime Bureau, which is interesting. [0:17:53] Uh, uh, that... So there's... The department does a fantastic job during the off-season of, of going through the code, trying to find things we can continue to modernize, nomenclature and processes, um, that protect the consumer and yet, uh, make it easier, uh, more cost effe- efficient, uh, to regulate these businesses that are touching... Frankly, they're touching the money of the citizens of Georgia. They're handling the money of the citizens in Georgia, and that's why it's important that, um, uh, we be on top of it at all times. [0:18:28] The department does an outstanding job of, of doing that. So with that, um, again, I mentioned that we have a substitution today. I'm gonna go over three main changes of the bill, um, that m- m- three main, um, [0:18:48] things that we're gonna be addressing this session, and I lost my copies of the three main things. There we go. Um, the first one is transaction holds. All of us are familiar with the financial fraud that's going on, um, throughout our state and our communities and the nation at large. And this bill's gonna attempt to put some guardrails around our elderly, uh, people that are get- so being subjected to, uh, financial fraud. [0:19:22] Uh, this bill, at the option of the lender, uh, to get trained in it, will allow a lending institution to be able to hit a pause button when they s- have strong suspicions that somebody elderly is su- uh, being subjected to financial, uh, uh, fraud. Uh, we've all heard about the AI, um, having the voice of the grandson or granddaughter calling up grandmother, granddaddy and saying, "Hey, I'm trapped. Uh, uh, we're in the... [0:19:52] My car's broken down. I've gotta have money. Can you wire me this money?" And they literally can take a voices, uh, the, the voice of this grandchild and have AI make it sound like it's the child speaking back. And so grandmother runs to the bank and wants to, uh, withdraw money and wire it to them, and, and so th- this bill would allow the department to work with banks, uh, to make sure there's training in place where our frontline, uh, people in the financial services industry would be able to help identify and stop some of that abusive behavior. [0:20:30] It does have good guardrails around it to protect the, the consumer's funds and allow legitimate transactions to transpire on time. [0:20:38] Mr. Chairman, can I ask you one question on that? [0:20:40] Sure. [0:20:41] I wanna say Representative Scott had talked to me. Uh, Representative Scott, didn't you talk to me about a bill similar? You were telling me, um... Would you like to interject real quick? I know you had had some issues, um, with someone in your district, I believe, that had some financial malfeasance that happened. [0:20:57] I know. Uh, uh, um, yes, I did talk with you about it, and I did, do have a bill, um, dealing with, uh, the impersonation of banking, because I was a victim of it. Um, so really have a lot of concerns where someone was, uh- Um, it came up saying my, my Microsoft, um, vi- I had a Microsoft virus and it acted as if there was someone from Microsoft talking, uh, to me. And then they had the opportunity to be guiding my computer, uh, to be guiding my computer from a back screen. [0:21:32] And, um, but thank God I was smart enough to get up and go to the bank- ... to, uh, to intercede before they can, uh, take, take my money out of my account. And the bank told me I was lucky because even when I got to the bank and they pulled up the account, they could st- they could still- they could see them trying to get in the door of, of my account at the bank. So, um, I think that it is, it is crucial that we get some guardrails to protect citizens from this type of thing happening to them. [0:22:04] And so, um, it's a good thing that we have this bill, but I definitely hope that it covers all those angles, uh, with the impersonation of people being able to, um, intercept on your computer, take over your computer and go into your information. [0:22:22] Yes, ma'am. Thank you. [0:22:23] Uh, uh, thank you, uh, Representative Scott. That... I had a member of my family had the exact same thing happen, uh, uh, to, uh, them that did, that happened to you. Uh, they clicked on the thing saying your computer's been seized, and the person had them online, and thankfully they, just like you, finally figured it out that it was fraud. This particular bill right now is just a first step on protecting our elderly in financial transactions. But you're, you've alluded to the larger picture that all of us are being subjected to all these, uh, very, uh, sophisticated, uh, attempts to defraud us of our money. [0:23:03] So this is one big bite at the apple to protect our elderly, elderly community. Um, so just real quickly is this, this proposal will allow the financial institution to place a hold of up to 15 days on an individual transaction that the, that the financial institution reasonably believes may involve, facilitate, result in, or contribute to financial exploitation if the customer is an eligible adult, which is basically disabled adults as defined by code or elderly adults, those 65 and older. [0:23:37] In addition to placing a hold on the transaction, the financial institution may reach out to a, quote, "trusted contact," which would be an adult designated by the account holder and notify them of suspected financial exploit- exploitation, which, uh, they could, um... It could be a son or daughter or a grandson or granddaughter, whomever, of a trusted family member that, uh, the financial institution could call them up and say, "Hey, grandmother's in here and they, th- this is what's going on. Uh, what do you think?" And the trusted person could, uh, uh, be a- aware of the situation and help get to the, um, bottom of it and make sure it's not fraud. [0:24:16] Once the transaction hold has been placed, the financial institution must initiate a investigation. If it results, uh, the results of the investigation do not indicate financial exploitation, then the, the financial institution can go ahead and with the transaction at the conclusion of the investigation. If the investigation is not concluded but continues to look like financial exploitation, then you, the, the law will allow them to extend that investigation for up to an additional 15 days. Um, but prior, importantly prior to implementing any kind of hold on the customer's funds, the financial institution must have policies and procedures in place and must have trained its employees. [0:24:57] So this, thi- this is very important the employees front, es- especially, uh, the people that are, the teller lines, uh, is what I think about, and the credit unions and the banks. Uh, our, most, most of them are highly well-trained and, uh, great people trying to serve the needs of the, uh, Georgia consumer, uh, con- Georgia consumers, and this would be just additional training for them to be able to spot these kind of, uh, situations. [0:25:23] Mr. Chairman, can I s- [0:25:24] Uh-huh. [0:25:24] I got two- [0:25:24] Yes, sir [0:25:24] ... I got two questions for you real quick. Number 13? [0:25:27] Sure. [0:25:29] Thank you, Mr. Chairman. [0:25:30] Yes, ma'am. [0:25:30] So is there any, uh, penalty if the bank employee, in our opinion, should have known but did not initiate this hold? [0:25:43] That's a good question. Uh, I know that if... This legislation would protect the bank if they go through these trained steps and, and, and, they go through this training and everything, but I'm not sure about absent this training, like what the current, what the current environment is. I guess your question is, if that happened today, is there any, uh, liability for the bank if they should have known but didn't do something about it? I'll defer to... By the way, this is Amy Patterson. She's the, uh, the attorney for the Georgia Department of Banking and Finance. [0:26:15] Uh, I can't remember the name of the attorney that used to do this with me, but- ... I think he's the, he is, Beau Fears is the commissioner. He's always been at my side, uh, at this, at these tables. I did tell him that, uh, Amy is, uh, uh, we, we, we improved our game a little bit. [0:26:31] Amen. Amen. Uh, Ms. Patterson, would you like to speak to that? [0:26:34] Sure. Um, do you have... Am I on here? Um, so the holds are discretionary on the part of the financial institution, so it's all about being able to identify, which is why that training is so important, so that the tellers can identify if someone comes in and can't answer transac- uh, questions about a transaction that's outside of the ordinary scope. But the financial institution is not liable for placing or for not placing a hold. [0:26:59] So in other words, uh, [0:27:04] the employees should have relationships with their customers, 'cause otherwise they would, they would not know. [0:27:11] Yes. [0:27:12] Yeah. [0:27:12] It's good for them if they have a relationship. It's also if somebody comes in and you can look at their transaction history and see that it's just out of the ordinary, and then can't answer questions or are answering questions that are raising a red flag, like what we've talked about with a s- scam coming in and that that's why they're trying to withdraw funds. [0:27:29] It's still a relationship business. Yes, ma'am. Good, good, good, good point. [0:27:33] Yeah. [0:27:33] Number 27. [0:27:36] Oh, thank you. I just have a couple of questions. Um, I guess first, my first question is on a trusted person. I know any legal documents is gonna override that, right? So if, if the banks, and I know we all have people that we know that do this. You- you've got a grandfather that's older, a grandmother, and all of a sudden one of the grandkids wanna be right there next to them, probably don't have the best intentions sometimes. But so if, if, if there's a power of attorney in place that the, that one of the actual siblings is that person, would the bank- [0:28:08] Mm [0:28:09] ... make them the trustee or how, how does that work? Where you got two people, in case that person dies, now you've got something tied up that one's the trustee on this account, but the other one's got the documents from where they've been having the power of attorney for years. [0:28:22] Sure. So this would be separate from a power of attorney. This is something where the consumer, the bank can allow the consumer, or the credit union can allow their member to designate someone outside of a power of attorney or outside of a second signer on an account to be that trusted contact. And so there could be both a power of attorney and a trusted contact that's been designated by the customer. [0:28:41] Okay. Um, could a follow-up? [0:28:43] Sure. [0:28:43] That leads me to another question now. So on a legal standpoint though, if that person passes away and, and you say you're a trusted person, they add me to that account, now I've got ownership of the money and stuff in that account or no? [0:28:55] No. So the trusted contact would just be for purposes of reaching out in connection with the financial institution. [0:28:59] So they couldn't come draw the money out theirselves- [0:29:01] No [0:29:01] ... or anything like that? [0:29:02] Mm. [0:29:02] Okay. All right. Thank you. [0:29:04] Uh, thank, thank you, Representative. Uh, number eight, Ms. Ward. [0:29:08] Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you for the bill. I think it's very much needed to have these guardrails to protect our seniors. Um, two questions. Um, I heard the words strong suspicion and reasonably believe. How would you define those words? [0:29:22] So I think that'll come back to kind of the training. And what we're looking at is if it comes in and there's reason to believe, whether it's because it's an unusual transaction or because the customer can't answer questions about it, and that's gonna come down to that level of training and what's happening on the bank side, on the employee side of what that looks like for what they deem to be a reasonable belief. [0:29:45] A follow-up? [0:29:46] Yes, ma'am. [0:29:47] Will the training be standard across all communities? [0:29:50] No. The department won't be prescribing training, but we will have benchmarks that we would expect training to look like. And the American Bankers Association has, uh, a number of states have similar laws, so there is a good amount of data out there in terms of what other states are doing and what other banks are doing in other parts of the country. [0:30:06] Thank you. [0:30:07] Mm-hmm. [0:30:07] Thank you, ma'am. Continue, Mr. Chairman. [0:30:09] So R- Representative Ward, it's, it's just, this is, you know, it's just a great first step to getting there to protect our seniors. And, um, but, uh, and anyhow, this, again, it's just the first step. Um, [0:30:28] let me see. I think I pretty much covered the overview. Oh, one, one thing I did wanna point out. The reason we have the, the, the substitute, which is very, very unusual on this, we're starting this out because of the fact that, um, part of this, uh, when there's elderly financial fraud suspected, uh, we wanted to make sure that if the, uh, Department of Human Services had any information that would be of help, that the financial institution could discuss that, uh, case or that person's situation, uh, with the Department of Human Services, and there had to be a, um, a change in the code to make sure that that, the, the Department of Human Services would be allowed to share that information. [0:31:12] Isn't that correct? [0:31:12] Yes. [0:31:13] Am I describing that properly? That's the layman's explanation of why we had to change, uh, some of the code sections in this and, and start off with a committee substitute. And to their, to their credit, the Department of Human Services spotted that conflict and made us aware of it. So the, the Department of Banking and Finance, um, quickly agreed and, and got the substitute before us today. The second thing, uh, is we're gonna be addressing this, is virtual currency kiosks. [0:31:43] These are basically ATMs that customers can put cash in and buy Bitcoin. They're in Georgia now. They have been in Georgia. Um, they are, by anybody's definition, they are, uh... [0:32:05] I hate to use word. They're, they're, they're, uh, criminal ATMs, but they c- they're very, very susceptible to being used for nefarious purposes. Um, they're here. Uh, this bill does, uh, regulate them. Uh, for the first time, it's putting some consumer protections in. Some of those consumer protections, well, I, let me, I'm gonna read one- [0:32:28] And there are, there are also limits, I think, up to $10,000- [0:32:31] They, they are. I'm gonna go through that- [0:32:32] ... or $2,500 per transaction [0:32:33] ... rather than miss anything, but these virtual currency kiosks, also known as Bitcoin ATMs, and I, I just keep thinking about the criminal behavior that goes through them, but have become a significant industry over the last several years. Uh, but they're currently licensed with the department as money transmitters. Uh, this will require annual registration of these. Um, the... I'm sorry, where are we going now? Here we go. [0:33:01] So that's, yeah. [0:33:02] And approximately 16 states have enacted this legislation. Um, and it, some of the important requirements are gonna be the disclosures are, among the other information, the, the kiosk, kiosk operator will have to alert customers that, one, the transaction is irreversible. Two, the virtual currency transactions are often used to defraud customers. That's where the criminal behavior and fraud comes in. Three, virtual currency is volatile and unpredictable, which may result in the partial or total loss of value of certain virtual currencies. [0:33:40] And this bill would limit the fee charged by vir- virtual currency operators, which nowadays can be as high as 30% to 18% of the total transaction amount, um- [0:33:54] So it's more like a buy- buy beware because if something goes wrong, you're- [0:33:58] Correct. You're gonna lose your- [0:33:59] You're on the hook [0:34:00] ... soon as you put your money in there, you have the risk- [0:34:02] It's on you [0:34:02] ... of losing it, uh, uh, to whomever it's going to. Um, w- you have the risk of losing that money. Uh, there are high transaction fees now, and the industry and the department has agreed that 18%, which is, is by all accounts, a very high number, but it's, it's lower than it is right now. It's unlimited. Um, and it would limit the aggregate daily transactions, to your point, uh, Chairman Williams, to $25 for new customers. [0:34:34] Uh- [0:34:34] Okay [0:34:34] ... and a new customer period is defined as the first three days. After a customer opens the account, it's limited to $10,000 for existing customers. [0:34:44] Yeah. Thank you. [0:34:45] And that ties back into the threshold for the, um, uh, money, um, transaction reports. Uh, what do we call that? The, uh, at the teller level, it's uh- [0:34:56] Suspicious activity. [0:34:57] Yeah, suspicious activity reports where cash is, uh... And that's been in place for a long time when there's a suspicion that somebody's laundering money. [0:35:06] Laundering money, right. We've got a, we've got a question for you, Mr. Chairman. [0:35:10] Okay. [0:35:10] Ms. Clark? [0:35:13] Thank you, Mr. Chair. Actually, my question... Oh, thank you, Mr. Chair. Actually, my question was to the other part of the bill, so actually I might just ask you- [0:35:21] Offline [0:35:22] ... um, after, um, since we've moved on to- [0:35:24] Okay. Sor- sorry about that. [0:35:25] No, it's okay. [0:35:26] Yeah. Thank you, ma'am. Can, uh, 21? [0:35:30] Mr. Chairman. [0:35:31] Mr. Chairman. [0:35:32] Uh, Chairman, thank you very much. Just a quick question. Do we have any idea in the state of Georgia how many of these kiosks exist, and who are the owners of these kiosks? [0:35:40] So we have some limited information. The department doesn't currently collect that information. Um, we understand that there's around 20 licensees that operate in this space. To some of them, this is their sole activity. Some of them may be doing other virtual currency activity as well. Um, and based on the last publicly available information we have, we think there's around 1,300 kiosks operating in Georgia. [0:36:00] Okay. And, but this legislation will also help track exactly what's out there and also who owns those and who operates them. [0:36:08] Correct. [0:36:08] It's a great first step. [0:36:09] Thank you. [0:36:11] Uh, Chair Lady, um, Hugley. [0:36:14] Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Is there a way to limit the amount per transaction? You're not doing that in this? [0:36:24] It's 20, $2,500. [0:36:25] It's $2,500, okay. [0:36:26] Per, per new account, but then 10,000- [0:36:29] In aggregate [0:36:29] ... for, no, 10,000 for established accounts. After the first, after your new account's established, you've had it for a while, then you can, it's up to $10,000. [0:36:39] But is that 10,000 per year? [0:36:41] Per day, I- [0:36:42] Is it per day? [0:36:43] Per year. Per year, per day. [0:36:45] Per day, per transaction. [0:36:47] Per day. [0:36:47] Daily tran- [0:36:48] Mm-hmm [0:36:48] ... okay, daily transaction. [0:36:49] Mm-hmm. [0:36:50] Okay. [0:36:50] And we think we're protecting people? [0:36:52] It's, it's the Wild West right now, Leader. I do not disagree with you. I don't like these things. It would suit me if the state of Georgia banned them, but that's not what's going on on a national level. I do not disagree with you. [0:37:04] So we couldn't lower that threshold, um, on the per day? [0:37:10] That's probably something we could look into next year after we get them up and running- [0:37:13] Okay [0:37:13] ... to s- we can tell how many we have. [0:37:16] This is a pretty good first step. [0:37:17] 28? [0:37:18] Uh, thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh, Mr. Chairman, I, I understand that these efforts are an attempt to help, uh, provide support to local m- municipalities who are having to deal with these issues themselves currently, and this is a way to help bring some consistency, uh, and some standards at least to, as a starting point so that the local county doesn't have to try and figure out themselves. [0:37:41] Are you t- [0:37:41] Is that accurate? [0:37:42] Sure. [0:37:42] Are you talking about local, uh, law enforcement? [0:37:44] Yes, sir. [0:37:46] That's a good point. [0:37:47] Yes, sir. [0:37:51] Number three. [0:37:53] I have a question for you, Mr. Chair. [0:37:54] All right. [0:37:55] Um, uh, thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, you mentioned, um, that there are lots of concerns about, like, fraudulent behavior and things using these kiosks. Do we have any specific examples here in Georgia of these, um, Bitcoin ATMs, like, and, and the fraudulent behavior associated with them? [0:38:16] I, I, I can, I know from personal experience that, uh, one of the scams that, that's going on is you'll get a phone call saying that, "Hey, there's an outstanding federal bench warrant against you." I literally had one of these calls in my office one day, and very professional-sounding law enforcement was on the other end that said, "Mr. Williamson, you missed a, a, a, a, a, a s- jury duty at federal court in Macon, Georgia." And I said, "Well, I never got a summons." He said, "That doesn't excuse you. [0:38:46] There's a federal bench warrant out for you. You can settle that by, you can go to your local sheriff's department. There's an outstanding warrant for your arrest. You can go to your local sheriff's department where you will be booked, uh, and then, uh, you can sort it out after you've been fingerprinted, uh, booked, and then you can sort it out or you can go to one of the, our, um..." They didn't, I forget w- the word they used, basically an ATM, and settle your outstanding fine. [0:39:19] And, and long story short, when I said, "I'm calling the sheriff," they hung up on me. But that, that is one of the frauds that you will hear mentioned. But what they're sending you to, I found out- Later, it's these kind of, um, um, cryptocurrency kiosks, and once that money's put in there, it is gone forever. So that is an example of my personal experience. I don't know if the department's been tracking other examples of that. [0:39:46] Not specifically. Uh, we do receive complaints about it, but I also know that a number of individuals will just go to law enforcement. So I've spoken to law enforcement across the state, and many of them have similar stories where they've had somebody come to them because they've been called in, you know, some sort of scam, like, uh, Chairman Williamson references, has been done, and then they go to these kiosks and they put the funds in. And then af- immediately after realize, "Hey, this didn't, this wasn't actually something that's ha- happening," and they go to law enforcement. And unfortunately, law enforcement, there's just nothing they can do. [0:40:18] These transactions are instant. They put the cash in, and the cash is trans- transferred into Bitcoin or another virtual currency and sent off to a wallet, and there's just not much that can be done. [0:40:29] All right, uh, that was my second question, is we have these ATMs in the... or machines, whatever you wanna call them, in the state, and no one actually is, like, before today, how, like how were they allowed to even be operated in the state and taking money and there was nothing stopping that from happening in the first place, I guess, the question? [0:40:53] It's a, they're a licensed business with us, so they are a money transmitter licensee with us currently. Uh, we just don't have specific protections for the virtual currency kiosks themselves. [0:41:03] Thank you. [0:41:04] Mm-hmm. [0:41:05] Uh, thank you, ma'am. Continue, Mr. Chairman. [0:41:07] These, these are good questions. Um, so on that note, the, um, I, I think really we've covered all the kiosk information. Um, the, I did wanna make the... I'm sorry, I didn't address the refund portion. Uh, so, uh, for refunds, for new customers, for the total amount, y- you, they would receive... Refunds would be mandatory for new customers for the total amount of the transaction if they were fraudulently induced to enter into the transaction and reported such transaction to law enforcement and the kiosk operator within five days. [0:41:46] So the examples I'm giving, that's a huge win for consumers right there. When grandmother gets conned into sending $5,000 in, in a, in a Bitcoin thing, if, if, if the objection's made within five days- [0:42:00] Mm-hmm [0:42:00] ... can prove that it was fraud, then the kiosk operator, to their credit, the kiosk operators, uh, are, are fine with that, and that is a win for the consumers. Because the, the, a crook's gonna have the money, as I understand it, but the kiosk operator would have to refund the money, and that might be one reason why the 18% is so high. It, it would be a high cost of doing business if they're in the refund business as well. Um, and for, and the refunds would be eligible for all customers for the fees related to the transaction if they were fraudulently induced to enter into the transaction. [0:42:35] So if it doesn't happen within five days, you can subsequently prove that you were a victim of a fraudulent transaction, you would just get whatever the fee was. In this case, it could be as high as 18%, so you're getting 18 cents on your dollar back. But right now you're not getting anything back. [0:42:52] Uh, thank you. We have one, Ms. Clark, you have one more question? [0:42:55] Yeah, just, um, um, uh, yes, thank you, Mr. Chair. Just on that, when you say kiosk operator, are we talking about, like, let's say I'm a gas station. [0:43:03] Mm-hmm. [0:43:03] The gas station owner has this kiosk in their business. Is the gas station owner the kiosk operator, or... Because earlier y'all said y'all don't even really know who owns these things, I guess. So, like, who is the kiosk operator? Who is actually giving the refund? [0:43:20] Sure. It would be the, uh, company that owns the machine or that's operating the machine. So it wouldn't necessarily be the gas station owner. In most cases, I don't think it would be the gas station owner. [0:43:30] Okay. [0:43:30] They would just have, the operator has a contract with the gas station owner, so it would be the operator themselves that's refunding. [0:43:37] The operator, okay. [0:43:37] Mm-hmm. [0:43:37] But earlier we said something like we weren't quite sure who owns these. [0:43:42] We don't have current data on where they're located, so we don't have for- [0:43:47] Mm [0:43:47] ... where all these locations are that they have contracts for. [0:43:50] Got it. Thank you. [0:43:50] Mm-hmm. [0:43:51] Uh, number 24. [0:43:53] Uh, yeah. Who owns k- these kiosks? I always assumed the banks, they were tied to banks, but they're not apparently. [0:44:00] The virtual currency kiosks are not tied to banks, no. So there are approximately 20 companies operating in Georgia that, uh, own these types of kiosks and run them, and they are licensed as money transmitters now. Um, there's a number of them, and there's a couple that have, I mean, they have up to 1,300 kiosks. [0:44:16] Okay. So, so they're, um... Follow-up? [0:44:19] Yes. [0:44:20] So there, there's some kind of regulations or, or, or something on them to help protect the consumer- [0:44:25] Yeah [0:44:26] ... on, on the books right now? [0:44:27] So we have some limited. Um, they are money transmitter licensees, so the same type of license type that, uh, your standard, uh, Western Union, uh, has, but we don't have anything specific to virtual currency kiosks in the law right now. [0:44:43] No, no, that's what we're saying. We're trying to get this implemented. Uh, 21. [0:44:48] Thank you. As far as those licensees holders, are those all US-based companies, or do we have any that are non-US based companies that are operating in Georgia? [0:44:58] I'm not sure. I can look into that and get that information for you. [0:45:01] For, for the committee's consideration, I think as we find out that information, that may be something that we consider bifurcating. I, I think a lot of the bad actors, I know, I think there's at least one that is a non-US based owner. Uh, at least that's what the folks in one of my jurisdictions law enforcement was trying to determine. Um, or even a partial non-US, a partnership if you will. I think we probably need to have a conversation about US-based versus non-US based at least for discussion. So thank you. [0:45:29] Uh, number 29. [0:45:31] Thank you, Mr. Chairman. So does this address Um, some sort of registration so we can track down and know? I mean, I'm just kind of worried that we, we don't know how many, where they are, what's... D- does this address that so we can officially start tracking the locations? [0:45:49] Yes, it does. Uh, we would get, the department would get information of where each, um, the address of each virtual currency kiosk and the name of the business. So we would have that information on where they're located and have better data than what we have right now. [0:46:05] Okay. Thank you. [0:46:07] Number 12. [0:46:09] Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh, any idea how much these are being used, uh, by the public at this point? [0:46:16] I do not. [0:46:17] Okay. [0:46:20] We just hear a lot of people talking about it nationally, and, um, it's, it's catching up with us here in Georgia now. So, um, Mr. Chairman, if you'd like to continue on. [0:46:28] Yes, sir. These, these are all great questions. Um, because again, we're g- we're just getting our rope around this, um, this abusive behavior on these things and trying to protect Georgia consumers. But the third big point of this bill was, is, or the major change in this bill is, uh, litigation financing. Did determine, uh, the General Assembly, um, uh, placed, um, under the, um, under our Tort Reform Act. [0:47:00] Uh, the l- litigation financing law was passed in 2025 as part of the tort reform effort and went into effect on January the 1st of '26. But broadly speaking, this law, one, protects consumers from abusive behavior by creating this disclosure regime for litigation financiers. In this case, it does eliminate foreign influence in civil cases by restricting foreign ownership of litigation financiers. It requires the litigation financiers to register with the Department of Banking and Finance, and four, makes the involvement of litigation financier discoverable in civil cases. [0:47:35] Um, we're, the department's proposing in this bill revisions to the existing law that will close some of these apparent gaps and more closely align with the regulation of other non-depository financial institution. Uh, and it's gonna en- ensure that the, uh, there's better teeth in the law and make sure that the law's, the vision of the law is being achieved. Uh, these changes include, uh, it would change the definition of financial institution to include the bank holding companies and credit unions, which is in alignment with the typical understanding of a financial institution, and that's under Title 7, our banking code. [0:48:14] It would propose to require annual registration as opposed to just a one-time registration now, uh, because it, that will ensure that companies remain eligible for the registration have not made any changes to the ownersh- ownership structure. Right now, they just have to register once. Well, heck, they can sell the company, still, still have that company name, have different ownership, and the, the department wouldn't be aware of that. So this has to be an annual update of the registration. [0:48:46] Um, further, this is in alignment with other regulated industries, and that g- goes to all the, um, the, uh, businesses that are touching our cust- uh, consumers, our citizens' money across all these, um, um, facilitators, from banks, credit unions, money transmitters, um, the whole nine yards. Uh, this would also propose to allow the department to access conviction histories for owners, officers, directors of l- litigation financer- financiers, which is the case with all the other industries as well. [0:49:22] This will allow the department to actually enforce the ban on individuals with a felony conviction within the last 10 years. This, um, that is in the, which is already in the current law. Um, it would propose to, propose to allow the department to issue cease and desist orders to entities or individuals who are operating without a license. Currently, the department's only remedy is to refer such entities or individuals for criminal prosecution. Uh, this, so therefore, you know, they could keep operating even though we, we don't have ability to, uh, make them cease and desist immediately. [0:49:56] This will enable the department to enforce the registration requirement without involving agencies that are busy prosecuting serious felonies. That's the three overarching sort of big changes in the bill. The rest of it, which we're happy to go through the line by line if, if, uh, Representative Demetrius Douglas wants me to, um, which, uh, we, we have a long-running joke about that, or we can go through section by section if it pleases the, um, committee. [0:50:26] I, I think we'll just entertain a few more questions. You did a- [0:50:28] Sure [0:50:29] ... thorough job, and I know you've done this year after year after year, and this one just seemed to have a little bit more, more bells, um, to it. Number 25. [0:50:37] Uh, thank you, Mr. Chairman. And, uh, I definitely am not gonna ask you to go line by line, uh- ... Senator Williamson. [0:50:44] I thank you. [0:50:44] Uh, great bill. I, I really like it, appreciate the intent. Um, but I've just got a couple concerns I think you, I would like for you to consider, um, with the, um, elderly financial fraud. Gr- great first stop, uh, s- at it, but, um, we're just really making it optional for banks to do that. You got the may. Do we know how many banks do that now? And could we get a report in a year or some time later about w- the uptake from the banks, whether they will do it or not? [0:51:20] I mean, I'm great with passed legislation, but if they don't adopt it, it's of no use. [0:51:26] Sure. Uh, so the, there are about 25 states, about half the states have passed something similar to this that allows banks to do it, and there's an a report- [0:51:35] From the American Bankers Association, uh, talking about transaction holds that's out there, talking about their usage and the banks that have the ability to do it and if they do it, and also talking about the banks that aren't in states that allow them to do it and whether they would utilize that. And the, the answer is, I don't have the, the data in front of me, but the majority of banks in these states are utilizing it on at least a re- semi-regular basis in order to protect consumers, and I'm happy to share that, American Bankers. But I just wanna make sure that, that the committee understands this bill really doesn't m- it, it gives them a, a blueprint, but really does not actually, um, do much. [0:52:18] Doesn't mean, well, doesn't mandate it. I'd like to get there. I mean, it's great legislation. We really need it. I can tell you some other examples in my district where, um, uh, they, a bank did not have this in place. The attorney or the family tried to get them to do this, and it, they just refused to really do something very similar to this. So it's a, it's a much needed thing. Thank you, uh, um, Chairman Williams, for bringing that to me. Thank, thank you, Chairman Dickey. [0:52:48] I'm, I'm gonna go back to Leader Higley's comments about know your customer. It didn't matter if it, if it's, um... I guess Leader Higley slipped out on me. But, um, y- you know, she's an insurance agents, agent, which was my old profession. We kn- we knew our customers when I was in the insurance business, as I'm sure she does, uh, as well. That's why I'm a big fan of community banks and, and, and local credit union affiliates. You walk in a, in a community bank or your credit union, and those front-line people know the customers, and they know, they will be, they will know that something's going on. [0:53:24] The, the large institutions, the big money center banks, their tellers are, um, uh, changing every day. They might go to a different bank every day. Uh, but it's, it's, it's, to your point, community banks and community, community credit unions I think are doing a good job of just knowing people, you know, getting somebody over and talking to them, talk, kind of talking through it and stopping a lot of this already. But when somebody's bound and determined, uh, in your local bank, that's when this thing can, the, the, at least this initial first step is gonna be very powerful. [0:54:00] Uh, and to your point about how wide the adoption is, I don't know, maybe there's a way for the Department of Banking and Finance and the credit unions to, um, to facilitate the training, to immediately, uh, highlight it, and maybe have some kind of encouragement through their associations to get people trained more quickly on it and get it in place more quickly because it is a important first step of protecting people's... Uh, and, and most of the time, these are retired people on limited incomes, and it just, it's wiping some of them out. So I don't disagree with you, but we're, this is- Thank you ... [0:54:33] step one. Thank you. Number 28. Yeah, I just, uh, thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you, uh, Mr. Chairman, uh, for, for bringing this bill to forward. I just, uh, absolutely applaud the first component of this bill, having been a former founder and CEO of a bank. Uh, I know how much pressure there is on the, on the person standing in f- the, in front of the client, uh, taking that deposit to try and make quick decisions and, and the ability to sort of put the brakes on things a little bit. Proud to be involved in a similar bill two years ago that helped financial planners have some additional latitude to, to put some, uh, put the brakes on transactions. [0:55:10] Once the money's gone, it's almost impossible to get it back. So that's a great component of the bill and a great start. On, uh, litigation financing, uh, the ability to, uh, get conviction histories I think is really a, a, an hugely important component with the Department of Bank and Finance. Having run a bank before and been on the other side of the table from the Department of Bank and Finance, when they, when they go through our banks, they do such a thorough job that I, I'm just in awe of the work that is done by the Department of Bank and Finance to regulate our banks. [0:55:41] But I think the conviction histories part is hugely important to help identify those bad actors on the front end. Uh, obviously, if you have somebody who's got a criminal history, knowing about that as a potential lender, whether it's litigation financing or anything else, I think that's the intent of that. Isn't that correct? Yes, sir. Mm-hmm. Thank you. Okay, thank, thank you. Um, Ms. Clark, number three. Um, thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, on the first part of the bill, now that we're talking about the whole bill again, um, I completely understand why this is absolutely necessary. [0:56:16] I think it's, um, horrible when people prey on, um, others that are very vulnerable in these types of situations. Um, and, but there are also times where something might seem like it's fraudulent and it actually isn't fraudulent. And so, uh, what happens if after this training it does lead someone to believe that something is wrong when it's not actually wrong and it has a adverse impact on the customer? [0:56:46] Let's say now they're about to get evicted or now they're about to lose something because of this financial ho- hold. Is there any liability on the bank side of that in this bill? So the hope is that because they have to initiate an investigation or they can t- reach out to the trusted contact, that on the front end they can resolve this before it gets to that point. Um, so if they come in and it gets flagged and they call the son, the daughter, whoever, and they say, "No, that's a standard transaction, you know, my mother is trying to do this, is trying to do that." Um, but ultimately there is no liability for the financial institutions if they place the hold or do not place the hold. [0:57:27] Thank you. Mm-hmm. Thank you, ma'am. All right, two more. [0:57:30] Number 21. Uh, just wanna make one comment then a quick question about section 12 just so I can understand. I know it's minor. I just wanna make sure I understand what, what we're striking there. To, um, my friend, uh, that had the concerns about the may versus the shall, uh, in my 28 years, typically when legislation like this is passed, the industry will respond with best practices, and I can tell you as a banker, this is something that many banks already are attempting to do without a framework. I think this framework will be adopted, if not by all, the vast majority within a v- very short period of time because it's just, it's, it, it's an ad- addition to the know your customer and how can you treat them, um, to protect them. [0:58:12] So with an elder mother as well, my brother and I try to do the same thing, so I appreciate the legislation. Uh, and can you just tell me what are we effectively doing by striking what we're striking in section 12? I just wanna make sure I understand the reasoning behind that. Sure. Um, so right, as of right now, the way the language is phrased, it, uh, requires a credit report run by one of the major credit institutions. Uh, with some of our bigger, uh, money transmitters and other companies, we are seeing some an- uh, individuals who don't have a credit history that's reported to the US credit bureaus. [0:58:47] So this allows us nine times out of 10, 99 times out of 100 even, we'll be doing the same thing. We'll still be looking at a US credit report. Okay. But for those individuals who don't have a US credit report, we can pull other investigative backgrounds. Okay. Perfect. Thank you. Thank, thank you. Last one, number 17. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I just wanna answer some of the last one. I wanna end on a, a lighter note. I think this a good start to what we're trying to do. Um, we've done everything. It's a lot of things that we don't do in our state that wish we did. [0:59:17] Um, but, uh, to the, my colleague that was a CEO, I never had a good time with Banking and Finance coming to my office. I always get fines. I don't know if it, they, they alluded fines when they got to their office or what. But, uh, I'll turn the air down and, uh- ... they'll minimize my fines. Thank you. Uh, thank you, Representative. What's the will of the committee? We have a motion do pass. Second. And we have a second. Do we have any questions? [0:59:48] All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed. Thank you so much, committee, and this meeting is adjourned. [0:59:59] A lot of good questions. Yeah. I must not be awake or something. Uh, I sort of f- fumbled around on that. Oh. Hey, man. You doing good? Doing good. Doing what my wife tells...