--- title: Senate Finance Committee, March 16, 2026 collection: meetings id: 2026-03-16/senate-finance cite_as: Senate Finance Committee, March 16, 2026, video https://vimeo.com/1172712385 (machine transcript by Georgia Commons) canonical_url: https://georgiacommons.org/meetings/2026-03-16/senate-finance md_url: https://georgiacommons.org/meetings/2026-03-16/senate-finance.md text_url: https://georgiacommons.org/meetings/2026-03-16/senate-finance/text source_url: https://vimeo.com/1172712385 date: 2026-03-16 status: machine transcript corpus_version: meetings-2026-10-23-8c15ead0f18d license: Machine transcript and summaries by Georgia Commons from the General Assembly's public video; the video stays on the General Assembly's Vimeo channel; see about.md publisher: Georgia Commons, an independent project of Georgia Civic Data. Not the State of Georgia. Not legal advice. up: https://georgiacommons.org/meetings/2026-03-16.md previous: https://georgiacommons.org/meetings/2026-03-16/senate-health-and-human-services.md next: https://georgiacommons.org/meetings/2026-03-16/senate-judiciary.md index: https://georgiacommons.org/meetings/index.md chamber: Senate body: Senate Finance Committee body_url: https://georgiacommons.org/meetings/senate-finance.md meeting_kind: committee session: 2025-2026 Regular Session start_time: 2026-03-16T16:00:00-04:00 location: MEZZ 1 duration_seconds: 4243.0 video_id: 1172712385 video_title: 03/16/2026 Senate Committee on Finance agenda_url: https://www.legis.ga.gov/api/document/agendas/senate/FinanceAgenda3.16.26.pdf bills_discussed: - HB 874 - HB 1261 - HB 964 - HB 1077 - HB 328 summaries_model: gpt-6.1-sol transcript_turns: 496 transcript_chars: 78178 parts: - https://georgiacommons.org/meetings/2026-03-16/senate-finance.md?start=0 - https://georgiacommons.org/meetings/2026-03-16/senate-finance.md?start=59882 --- # Senate Finance Committee, March 16, 2026 Senate Finance Committee; March 16, 2026; 2025-2026 Regular Session. Video, on the General Assembly's Vimeo channel: https://vimeo.com/1172712385. Agenda: https://www.legis.ga.gov/api/document/agendas/senate/FinanceAgenda3.16.26.pdf. > This is a machine transcript of the General Assembly's video, made by a speech-recognition model. It is not an official record and can mishear words, names, and numbers. Speakers are not identified. The video is the record: every timestamp links to the moment it plays. ## Summary written by Georgia Commons Written by gpt-6.1-sol from the transcript below. It is not part of the record. Quote the transcript or the video, not the summary. The Senate Finance Committee approved all five bills it considered. Members unanimously approved [HB 874](https://georgiacommons.org/bills/2025-2026/hb874), concerning taxpayer phone-number privacy, [HB 1261](https://georgiacommons.org/bills/2025-2026/hb1261), allowing local inventory-tax exemptions for electric utilities, and [HB 964](https://georgiacommons.org/bills/2025-2026/hb964), concerning tax exemptions for independently contracted fire departments. The committee approved [HB 1077](https://georgiacommons.org/bills/2025-2026/hb1077), extending an arts-admission sales-tax exemption, by an announced 8–2 vote. Members also approved a substitute for [HB 328](https://georgiacommons.org/bills/2025-2026/hb328) expanding scholarship tax credits and eligibility, 8–3. Much of that discussion concerned whether the scholarship program should expire automatically in 2032. An amendment to remove that expiration failed, 5–6. ## Bills discussed (5) Each account was written by gpt-6.1-sol from the stretch of the transcript it names. The bill's number is said in that stretch, unless it was the only bill on a committee's agenda. ### HB 874. Georgia Taxpayer Privacy Protection Act; enact [HB 874](https://georgiacommons.org/bills/2025-2026/hb874) (2025-2026 Regular Session). From [0:17:33](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1053s), turns 5 to 26. The sponsor said [HB 874](https://georgiacommons.org/bills/2025-2026/hb874) would prohibit disclosure of taxpayers’ telephone numbers when property-tax records are sold, transferred or shared with third parties, with civil penalties for improper disclosure. The sponsor said government agencies could still use the information internally for tax administration. The sponsor described the purpose as protecting property owners, including seniors, from unwanted calls and misuse of personal contact information. No substantive questions were asked. The committee unanimously approved the bill. ### HB 1261. Revenue and taxation; level 1 freeport exemptions for certain goods in inventory for electric utilities; provide [HB 1261](https://georgiacommons.org/bills/2025-2026/hb1261) (2025-2026 Regular Session). From [0:19:47](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1187s), turns 33 to 117. The sponsor said [HB 1261](https://georgiacommons.org/bills/2025-2026/hb1261) would let local governments offer an inventory-tax exemption of up to 100% for electric utilities, subject to voter approval, without affecting state tax revenue. The sponsor said savings could support lower customer costs, infrastructure or additional emergency supplies. Asked why the bill faced House opposition, the sponsor suggested misunderstanding and concerns about utilities and exemptions, without identifying a specific opposing argument. A committee member asked whether any inventory was already untaxed. The sponsor initially expressed uncertainty about current law, then said none was exempt to the sponsor’s knowledge. The sponsor said the bill covered electric cooperatives, Georgia Power and municipal electric utilities, not natural-gas companies, and knew of no municipalities currently seeking the exemption. Another member said year-end inventory reporting coincided with winter-storm preparations and argued that removing the tax would encourage emergency stockpiles. A Georgia EMC witness supported the bill, saying cooperative savings ultimately benefit members and current policy discourages preparedness. The committee unanimously approved the bill. ### HB 964. Revenue and taxation; state and local title ad valorem tax fee; exempt certain motor vehicles used in fire protection services for local governments [HB 964](https://georgiacommons.org/bills/2025-2026/hb964) (2025-2026 Regular Session). From [0:29:31](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1771s), turns 128 to 167. The sponsor said [HB 964](https://georgiacommons.org/bills/2025-2026/hb964) would give independently contracted fire departments, commonly volunteer departments, the same vehicle and equipment tax exemptions as city and county fire departments. The sponsor said both types perform the same public service and reported no concerns from the Department of Revenue, county and municipal associations, or the volunteer fire association. One committee member supported equal treatment and said the savings could help rural volunteer departments obtain lifesaving equipment. Another member asked about a separate provision concerning nicotine-product dealers. The sponsor described it as a registration correction intended to treat out-of-state and in-state vendors equally for home sales. The committee unanimously approved the bill. ### HB 1077. Sales and use tax; exemption for sales of tickets, fees, and charges of admission to certain museums and fine arts performances or exhibitions at nonprofit facilities; extend sunset date [HB 1077](https://georgiacommons.org/bills/2025-2026/hb1077) (2025-2026 Regular Session). From [0:33:29](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2009s), turns 169 to 248. The sponsor said [HB 1077](https://georgiacommons.org/bills/2025-2026/hb1077) would extend the sales-tax exemption for qualifying museum admissions and fine-arts performances or exhibitions at nonprofit facilities from the end of 2027 through 2032. The sponsor said Georgia ranked last in arts support and emphasized benefits for smaller rural communities. The chair cited a fiscal note showing $6.5 million for the state and $5.7 million for local governments. One member questioned different treatment of nonprofit and for-profit venues. The sponsor expressed openness to an amendment treating them alike, but none was offered. Another member said arts venues had not fully recovered from COVID and continued supporting local economies; the sponsor agreed. A third member questioned why eligibility depended on the venue rather than the performance. The sponsor confirmed that distinction and acknowledged that some church events could qualify, although the discussion did not fully resolve those examples. After recounting raised hands, the chair announced approval, 8–2. ### HB 328. Revenue and taxation; increase annual aggregate limit for tax credits available for certain contributions to student scholarship organizations [HB 328](https://georgiacommons.org/bills/2025-2026/hb328) (2025-2026 Regular Session). From [0:40:07](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2407s), turns 258 to 493. The sponsor said the substitute for [HB 328](https://georgiacommons.org/bills/2025-2026/hb328) would raise the scholarship-donation tax-credit cap from $120 million to $225 million, versus $140 million in the House version. The sponsor described waivers of the six-week public-school attendance requirement for active-duty military families and specified disabilities, removal of scholarship limits for certain disabilities, a ban on income from scholarship organizations for legislators and spouses, a 6% insurance-premium allocation, and a PEACH credit increase from $15 million to $25 million. The sponsor argued the program saved money, citing average scholarships of $4,700 versus $6,300 in state school funding. The chair questioned savings and accountability; another member questioned the expansion’s effect on other education priorities. A Cristo Rey Atlanta witness said credits supplied 30% of the school’s budget. Georgia GOAL said its administrative fee was 4%, below the allowed 8%. Both witnesses opposed expiration because of long-term scholarship commitments; Frontline Policy supported expansion. Members debated whether expiration in 2032 would disrupt families or provide necessary financial review. One member also questioned private schools’ capacity to serve varied disabilities. The amendment removing expiration failed, 5–6. The committee approved the substitute with expiration, 8–3. > The transcript runs 78,178 characters. A reader that cannot take it at once can read it in 2 parts: part 1 https://georgiacommons.org/meetings/2026-03-16/senate-finance.md?start=0; part 2 https://georgiacommons.org/meetings/2026-03-16/senate-finance.md?start=59882. ## Transcript (496 turns) [0:16:36](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=996s) If we get everybody's attention, we've got some people coming down from Health. Our meetings sort of stacked on top of each other today, but I'm gonna do the same thing to, to Judiciary if, if I don't try to get going here, 'cause they follow us. Um, Senator Hickman, would you do the invocation for us? You're, you're on- [0:16:52](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1012s) Yeah [0:16:52](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1012s) ... two, yeah. [0:16:52](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1012s) Yeah. Thank you, sir. Let us pray. Lord God, you've given us another great day here, and Father, we just thank you for the opportunity that you've given us to be in this room and, Lord, to represent the great people of the state of Georgia. Lord, just give us wisdom, justice, moderation, courage as we deliberate on these bills. In your Son's name we pray. Amen. [0:17:09](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1029s) Amen. All right. [0:17:22](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1042s) Let me tell... Somebody I was telling to hurry up and get here, they don't have to now that we have a quorum. All right. The first bill we were gonna hear today was, um, HB, um, 874 by Representative Huddleston. If you wanna come up front here. [0:17:38](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1058s) Sir. [0:17:39](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1059s) I can't remember if you've been to the Finance Committee meeting before or not. I- [0:17:43](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1063s) I, I was in here the other day. I hadn't presented before, but I- [0:17:46](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1066s) That's right [0:17:46](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1066s) ... stood in here. I stood in here the other day. [0:17:48](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1068s) Oh, but you didn't present? [0:17:49](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1069s) No, sir. [0:17:49](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1069s) Yeah, okay. [0:17:50](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1070s) No, this is my first time presenting before the committee. [0:17:52](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1072s) Okay. Well, welcome to the Finance Committee. We're not as bad as you hear, so. [0:17:57](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1077s) We're worse. [0:17:58](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1078s) Worse. [0:18:00](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1080s) All right. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you to the committee. Uh, today on, uh, House Bill 874, um, this is known as the Georgia Taxpayers Privacy Tech Protection Act. Uh, so this piece of legislation aims to enhancing taxpayer privacy in property tax records. This would be... This bill would prohibit the disclosure of taxpayers' telephone numbers when property tax records are sold, transferred, shared to third parties. Under this proposal, anyone improperly disclosing telephone, phone numbers could face civil penalties in violation of this law. [0:18:31](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1111s) The intent is to protect personal contact information from being publicly exposed or misused while still allowing government agencies to use the data internally for their tax administrations. Basically, the intent of this is just basically the pri- Privacy Protection Act as we all receive those phone calls and that, that thing there. And, and one of the concerns is, is not only is the local agencies can utilize those, that personal information within their records, but once it gets into a third party's hands, we never know where it may, uh, end up there. So basically, protecting seniors and all of us as property tax owners. [0:19:03](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1143s) It's just removing that phone number. [0:19:06](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1146s) All right. Um, any questions from the committee? Everybody understand it okay what we're doing? We're just protecting the phone number- [0:19:15](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1155s) Appropriate [0:19:16](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1156s) ... from being public record. So go ahead, Senator Albers. [0:19:19](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1159s) I move, uh, we do pass, uh, House Bill 874, LC443508S. [0:19:25](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1165s) Second. [0:19:26](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1166s) We have a motion, Senator Albers, second by Senator Anderson. Any discussion from anybody? If not, all in favor, say, raise your hands or... All right, motion carries unanimously. You've got one more and I'll let you stay up there I guess, so. [0:19:39](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1179s) Okay. Thank you, sir. [0:19:40](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1180s) Um- [0:19:40](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1180s) Uh, yeah, basically this is, uh- [0:19:43](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1183s) Wait, wait a minute. [0:19:43](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1183s) Oh. [0:19:43](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1183s) Let's go back and make sure everybody knows what bill we're looking at. [0:19:46](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1186s) Yeah, 1261. [0:19:47](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1187s) LC number and all that. All right. [0:19:50](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1190s) It should be, uh- [0:19:51](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1191s) LC560550. [0:19:53](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1193s) That- [0:19:53](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1193s) Is that what you, you're looking at? [0:19:54](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1194s) That's correct. Yeah. This is, uh, House Bill 1261. Uh, it proposes an amendment to Georgia Tax Code to create a level one Freeport exemption for certain goods held in inventory by electrical utilities. This bill is designed to offer targeted tax relief and qualifying inventory, establish an application process through the local county where the property is located, and update related provisions that state law is to ensure proper administration to the exemption. Basically, what this, uh, piece of legislation is doing is basically adding the language in to where it would allow electrical utilities to have that conversation with their local governments, uh, to determine a percentage of exemption from zero to 100%. [0:20:36](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1236s) Uh, basically, then it would go to a referendum before the electors to be voted in. So this is just adding the language into this, this, uh, part of where it will allow them to have that conversation. [0:20:46](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1246s) All right, Senator Albers. [0:20:48](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1248s) Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Just to sum this up, this is simply a local control bill. Has no impact on state tax dollars whatsoever. Is that true? [0:20:54](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1254s) That is 100% correct. [0:20:55](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1255s) Thank you. [0:20:58](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1258s) Um, we've got somebody signed up to testify, but if you're for it, I don't think you need to testify. [0:21:05](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1265s) Okay. [0:21:05](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1265s) You might talk us out of it if you- ... bring up something that we, we, maybe we missed, you know. All right. Um, I don't see any other questions. Um- [0:21:15](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1275s) Oh. [0:21:15](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1275s) Oh, sorry. We got Senator Dolezal. Go ahead. [0:21:18](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1278s) Thank you, Representative. Can you articulate to the best of your ability, this is not your position obviously, but what... There's some pretty strong opposition in the House it looked like to this. What was the stated opposition, reason for the opposition? [0:21:30](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1290s) I think basically, I guess let me build on that and then I go from there. Basically, I, I spent 36 years with electric utilities of EMCs, and part of one of the hats I wore was in- inventory related. And a lot of times within this right here, I think we, we, we have talked a lot about this last year, or over the years of reliability of service to our customers and actually save dollars to the rate payer. So basically within opposition there, I think there's been a lot of, uh, uh, misunderstanding or language within basically it's been held in the past with utility companies, uh, not only of EMCs, Georgia Power, MEAGs, and that type thing there. [0:22:05](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1325s) But at the end of the day, my intent is, like you said, number one is to save dollars for the rate payer, but the reliability of service, no different than the storms we faced last night. This allowed us to basically have that inventory on the yard, but then I was, I was required to have a certain number, a level of inventory that basically at the end of the year we had to pay tax, uh, pa- tax upon. So what this can actually do there is the dollar savings within that Freeport tax, they can actually invest it back into the infrastructure and/or, uh, have more equipment for reliability or actually save their tax dollars. [0:22:36](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1356s) Can I ask a couple of questions? [0:22:37](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1357s) I, I was... I'm not sure you answered the question. [0:22:38](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1358s) Yeah, he didn't answer it at all. [0:22:39](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1359s) Oh. [0:22:39](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1359s) But that's okay. Um, which is fine. [0:22:42](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1362s) Well, I, I- [0:22:42](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1362s) If you don't wanna answer it, that's fair [0:22:43](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1363s) ... think it goes back that they spent within, there's been a lot of language, like so a lot of conversation within rate payers, exemptions, and things like that within, within, within this discussion. [0:22:52](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1372s) So are you just kind of general- anti-power company sentiment is- [0:22:56](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1376s) I think, I think people, I think may, pe- some people may perceive that- [0:22:59](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1379s) Okay [0:22:59](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1379s) ... but it's, it is nowhere near that. [0:23:01](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1381s) So, and I'm glad you got experience in this 'cause I don't. So w- the inventory that you held, was all of that taxes inventory or was there a, you know, a, like current, was there a specific amount that was not subject to that tax and the kind of the extra was- [0:23:14](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1394s) I, I think, I think what that does, uh, basically that gives you that negotiation tool 'cause in inventory, it- [0:23:19](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1399s) What, what do you mean that give- [0:23:20](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1400s) That would basically, once that's- [0:23:22](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1402s) What, what, what's the current law as it relates to the taxation of inventory? [0:23:25](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1405s) I'm not sure of the current laws. I just know within the inventory, basically it was 15410 and 36- 36810, which is your inventory materials of transformers and then the hardwares. So basically that allows the conversation with your local, uh, local government to have that discussion on which materials would be exempt. [0:23:42](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1422s) I guess what I'm trying to understand is what's been explained to me in the hallways is these companies want to hold more inventory to be able to service in a, in a power outage situation, which makes perfect sense, and they're arguing that they're being penalized for stocking that inventory. What I didn't know that I'm asking- [0:23:58](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1438s) Well, and that- [0:23:59](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1439s) ... is if there's a current amount of inventory they can currently hold without being taxed. [0:24:03](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1443s) To, to my knowledge, no, because I'll be- [0:24:05](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1445s) Okay [0:24:05](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1445s) ... basically, I can give you one example. We have a, uh, at my local utility, we have a company that is, is, uses German equipment. It's German. They come over. So basically they had to have a special vote, voltage, uh, required to run the equipment. We was required, number one, to provide that transformer for that company to provide that voltage. But to go back to reliability of service, we actually had to have a transformer on the yard that may last 20 years there at that, that business, but we was required to have that transformer for, for reliability of service. [0:24:35](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1475s) Yeah. Mr. Chair, one more if, if I may. Does this apply to all utility companies? Uh, there's a lot of conversation about EMCs. Does this, does this cli- apply to natural gas companies? Does this- [0:24:45](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1485s) No, this, basically electric utilities for this would be your EMCs and your Georgia Power, basically your MEAGs, your local municipal- palities. It's like City of Newnan basically owns their electrical utility. [0:24:55](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1495s) Do you know of municipalities currently that are wanting to waive this tax or? [0:24:59](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1499s) I do not. [0:25:00](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1500s) Okay. [0:25:01](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1501s) I think it's left up to each individual and their local government. Like you said, no state physical impact, but it leaves it to local, local insight. [0:25:08](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1508s) And they can't do this now. You're just looking to allow them to do this if they want to. [0:25:11](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1511s) To add, add the language in here to allow them to have that conversation. [0:25:13](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1513s) Okay. [0:25:14](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1514s) And I would assume that I'm not hurting opposition from ACCG or GMA. [0:25:19](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1519s) I dro- [0:25:20](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1520s) Um, I assume it's- [0:25:20](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1520s) Yeah [0:25:20](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1520s) ... because they're permissive and not mandatory that that's the case. [0:25:23](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1523s) Correct. I would think so, yes. [0:25:25](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1525s) Senator Harbin. [0:25:27](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1527s) Thank you. [0:25:28](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1528s) Sure. [0:25:28](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1528s) Uh, am I correct, is this basically though, if the county says, "We're not gonna tax you," then you're not gonna bill the customer for whatever that, that savings to you that you should be able to pass on to the customer. Am I correct? [0:25:40](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1540s) Yeah. Yes, sir. I would think so. Like you said, it allows them the avenue within those dollar savings. Like I said, it would, could pass it on to the customer and, or as, as, you know, as it was mentioned, it may be able to, um, uh, uh, have the opportunity to stock some more materials for the reliability of service. [0:25:56](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1556s) Okay. [0:25:57](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1557s) So I think, I think it could be utilized in many ways. [0:25:59](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1559s) Okay. Okey doke. Thank you. [0:26:02](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1562s) All right, and Senator Gooch. [0:26:05](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1565s) If the utility companies aren't gonna testify, I'm j- just gonna make a couple statements but ask questions. Isn't it true that this inventory is gathered at the first of the year, so it's reported as of December 31st of each calendar year? [0:26:19](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1579s) That is correct. [0:26:20](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1580s) And so that's also the time of year when the utilities, especially up in North Georgia where we are, have to stock up the most transformers and most telephone poles and hardware preparing for the ice storms and snow storms and therefore a lot of breakdowns. Is that not correct? [0:26:35](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1595s) That is correct. [0:26:36](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1596s) And so you got South Georgia EMCs that come to North Georgia during the s- snow and ice storms. Then if you guys recall during Hurricane Helene, all of our utility companies in North Georgia went to South Georgia, and every one of them took all their utility equipment, their manpower, their bucket trucks, their transformers, their poles, and all the hardware with them, and they let them have all that equipment and all those in inventory. So if we, if we do this, if we eliminate the, the tax on this equipment, it incentivizes the power companies to keep more inventory on hand for when we do have those tragic storms. [0:27:12](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1632s) Is that not correct? [0:27:13](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1633s) Correct. [0:27:14](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1634s) Thank you. [0:27:15](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1635s) All right, and Jason, you're still welcome to testify, but I think Senator Gooch did a decent job. But come on up. Now, now he comes up. [0:27:24](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1644s) Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Jason Bragg, Vice President of Government Relations with Georgia EMC. Um, I think Representative Huddleston did a wonderful job explaining the bill. Um, obviously our EMCs are in full support as not pr- uh, not for profit and electric cooperatives. Any savings that we can find, whether it's through taxes or things like this, are ultimately passed on to those members at the end of the line. Um, and I think Senator Gooch did a great job of pointing out this is a, um, a situation where public policy kind of disincentivizes emergency preparedness, and this just, bill just allows us to go have those conversations with our local governments about abating all or a portion of that inventory tax. [0:28:00](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1680s) We're paying for that high dollar equipment that just right now has to sit on the yard. Happy to answer any more questions. [0:28:07](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1687s) All right. Any more questions from the committee? I'm not hearing any. We can probably do a motion now if somebody's ready to do that. [0:28:14](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1694s) Sure. [0:28:16](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1696s) We got a motion from Senator Gooch, a second from, uh, Senator Hickman. Any discussion on this? If not, all in favor raise your hand. Unanimously. Thank you. [0:28:27](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1707s) Thank y'all so much. [0:28:28](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1708s) Tell them, tell them how easy it is over here in finance, you know? [0:28:30](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1710s) Thank you. Appreciate it. [0:28:35](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1715s) All right, we're gonna have, um, uh... Find my list here. [0:28:46](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1726s) Um, Representative Cannon, if you wanna come up. Give me just a second to get my papers in order. [0:28:55](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1735s) Mr. Chairman, I think half the room just left. [0:29:04](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1744s) Chas, you thought they were all here to greet her. [0:29:05](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1745s) I thought they were here too. [0:29:15](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1755s) All right, Representative Cannon, the floor is yours. Go ahead. [0:29:17](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1757s) Thank you, Mr. Chairman, members of the committee. It's good to be- [0:29:19](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1759s) Get everybody's attention here, please. [0:29:21](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1761s) Good to, good to be back in the gauntlet again, as I call it over here in Senate Finance. [0:29:25](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1765s) That's right. [0:29:26](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1766s) Um, I have a very straightforward bill for you to consider today. The, the purpose of this bill, House Bill 964, is to treat independently contracted fire departments the same as local government departments in terms of ad valorem and sales tax. In most cases, these independently contracted departments are what we call volunteer fire departments, and they perform the same function as fire departments that are organic or, uh, are organic to cities and counties. Those local, uh, fire departments are exempt from ad valorem taxes and sales taxes on equipment and the motor vehicles. [0:30:01](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1801s) Independently contracted fire departments are not. And again, both are performing the same service for the public, uh, as it pertains to OCGA 25-3-1 and 25-3-2, which is public safety and fire. So in quick summary, House Bill 964 would make independently contracted fire departments exempt from those same taxes, uh, so that they would be treated equally as in-house fire departments. I think this is a fairly common sense approach to the issue. I've spoken with DOR, ACCG, GMA. [0:30:32](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1832s) Um, no issues there. I've spoken with the Volunteer Fire Association. Uh, no issues there. Appreciate Senator Albers' input on this bill. Uh, that's the genesis of the bill. Mr. Chairman, I'll take any questions. [0:30:43](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1843s) All right. Senator Albers. [0:30:45](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1845s) Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh, Representative Cannon, thank you for bringing this forward. I'm usually against any and all tax credits, but in this case, because it is so inconsistent with everybody else, we're picking winners and losers. Uh, and that's wrong. Uh, in this case as well, volunteer fire departments are the ones that need access to equipment and have the least amount of dollars to spend. So this could, uh, make a meaningful difference, especially in our rural areas, for them to get life-saving equipment. Is that not true? [0:31:09](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1869s) It is true. Thank you, mister. Thank you for the question. [0:31:11](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1871s) At the appropriate time, Mr. Chairman. [0:31:13](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1873s) All right. Um, and plus, with it being firemen, you have a special place in your heart for this too. [0:31:18](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1878s) I do. I have a- [0:31:20](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1880s) Little prejudice that way. [0:31:21](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1881s) Yes, I do. [0:31:22](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1882s) Any other questions from the committee? All right, Senator Dolezal, uh, go ahead. [0:31:27](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1887s) What does Section 3 of the bill do? That's the nicotine- [0:31:31](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1891s) Oh, okay [0:31:32](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1892s) ... product dealer. [0:31:33](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1893s) That actually is just a cleanup from something where the out-of-state, uh, weren't in the, uh, same category as your in-state. It's just to treat them equally. [0:31:43](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1903s) Treat who equally? [0:31:44](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1904s) The, uh, the vendors that sell. They, they weren't having to register in Georgia. And, um, [0:31:51](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1911s) I can, I can get somebody up here to speak on that if, if you would like. I believe it's Brad. [0:31:57](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1917s) Can you say again what it does? [0:31:58](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1918s) It's Brad here? [0:31:59](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1919s) Can you say again what it does? I'm not following. [0:32:00](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1920s) Well, the, the original code had a problem where the, um, out of state weren't required to register for home sales as the in-state do. [0:32:10](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1930s) Just makes it equal. [0:32:10](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1930s) And it just makes it equal for our, so that our in-state dealers aren't treated any differently. [0:32:21](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1941s) It's about a six-word cleanup, I think, just treat them all equally. [0:32:26](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1946s) All right, we'll take a motion if you're ready. Senator Albers. [0:32:29](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1949s) Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh, move we do pass, uh, House Bill 964, LC 59-0428S. [0:32:37](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1957s) Got a second by Senator Halpern. Any other discussion from anybody? All in favor, raise your hand. All right, passed unanimously. Um, I forgot, is Representative Huddleston still here? We didn't get your... He probably left. I didn't get his, uh, Senate sponsors. [0:32:55](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1975s) Oh, it was, uh, Brass, Matt Brass, hearing aid. [0:32:59](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1979s) Okay. Both of them? [0:33:01](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1981s) Uh, utility, so I'm not sure. [0:33:02](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1982s) Okay, we'll have to get with him another. Who, who's your Senate- [0:33:04](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1984s) Mr. Chairman, Senator Albers would be- [0:33:06](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1986s) Okay [0:33:06](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1986s) ... Senate sponsor. [0:33:07](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1987s) All right, great. [0:33:09](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1989s) Thank you very much. [0:33:09](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1989s) Thank you, chairman. [0:33:09](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1989s) Appreciate it. [0:33:17](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=1997s) All right, and, uh, Representative Williams. [0:33:28](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2008s) We've got House Bill 1077, LC 59-0271. [0:33:33](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2013s) Yes, sir. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. This bill simply extends the, uh, ta- [0:33:37](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2017s) Give me just a second. Make sure everybody pulls their copy out here. All right. Looks like everybody's got them. Go ahead. [0:33:44](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2024s) Okay. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh, House Bill 1077 basically extends the sales tax ex- exemption for tickets and related fees for fine arts performances or exhibitions if they are held, um, in a 501[c][3] not-for-profit or culturally significant museum focusing on arts, education or cultural programming. Basically, this runs out in December of 2027, and this just extends it through the end of 3030- of 2032. Georgia ranks 50th in supporting the arts, and this will be a good way to put a good foot forward supporting the arts. [0:34:25](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2065s) And I think we had a, a fiscal note on it. Um- [0:34:27](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2067s) Yes, sir. [0:34:31](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2071s) The fiscal note on this is- [0:34:32](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2072s) So that's- [0:34:33](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2073s) ... six and a half million for the state, 5.7 for locals. [0:34:39](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2079s) Senator, Senator Albers, go ahead. [0:34:42](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2082s) Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh, great to see you, uh, Representative Williams. [0:34:45](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2085s) Good to see you, sir. [0:34:46](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2086s) Uh, as I was just saying in the last bill, I, I don't like picking winners and losers. In this case, we do, because we tell someone who is a for-profit that they're going to pay and those that are nonprofit do have to pay. Uh, it just seems odd to me that we would treat them inconsistently Do you have any thoughts on that? [0:35:01](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2101s) Well, we had, um, someone had brought that up a few minutes ago, and if y'all would like to offer a friendly amendment, we would be fine with that where we treated both of them the same way. [0:35:11](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2111s) Uh, I, I was thinking of that, too, but probably the other way . Thanks. [0:35:17](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2117s) All right, Senator Halpern. [0:35:19](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2119s) Um, thank you. Isn't it true that, um, our arts sector and our venues still have not seen full recovery post-COVID and continue to contribute despite that to the local economy that they each in, that they each serve in? [0:35:40](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2140s) Yes, ma'am. The lady knows of what she speaks. [0:35:43](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2143s) And while some people might think that this only helps the larger arts institutions, um, would you share whether it also actually affects more specifically the smaller ones- [0:35:57](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2157s) Yes, the s- [0:35:57](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2157s) ... that actually don't have as much bandwidth? [0:35:59](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2159s) The smaller rural areas like my, from, instance, I represent Cordele and Fitzgerald, and Fitzgerald and also in Hawkinsville. Um, it really impacts our area and the smaller communities where we're big, avid sports fans. We also have kids that are big in the arts, and so we need to make sure that they're recognized as well. [0:36:17](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2177s) Thank you. [0:36:19](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2179s) All right, Senator Dolezal. [0:36:21](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2181s) Thank you, Representative. Good to see you. I just want to make sure I understand what we're doing here. I just, um, I do a little bit of work in the music space, and if you were to do a symphony at Cobb Galleria- [0:36:33](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2193s) Uh-huh [0:36:33](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2193s) ... there would be no sales tax charged on- [0:36:37](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2197s) On the tickets- [0:36:37](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2197s) ... on the tickets [0:36:38](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2198s) ... and on the food. [0:36:39](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2199s) Okay. And if that same entity went up and did the same show at The Roxy- [0:36:45](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2205s) Okay [0:36:45](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2205s) ... there would be s- sales tax charged on the tickets and the food. In other words, the incentive is to, the, the incentive is based on the venue, not based on the performance. [0:36:53](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2213s) Correct. [0:36:54](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2214s) I'm curious why that would be the trigger for fine arts. A- and I guess that gets back to what you were saying to Albers- [0:37:00](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2220s) Right, right [0:37:00](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2220s) ... is let's just- [0:37:00](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2220s) And that, that's the way the bill was in the sunset in 2027, and, you know, it sunsets in 2032. We were trying to extend that and, you know, like I said, that, that's a good idea if we could, we could add that to the bill. [0:37:12](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2232s) Can I go one more question- [0:37:13](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2233s) Sure [0:37:13](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2233s) ... Mr. Chairman? So a lot of 501[c][3]s are obviously churches. [0:37:17](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2237s) Correct. [0:37:18](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2238s) If a church hosts a dance- [0:37:22](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2242s) I don't know of any churches that charge for dances or fairs or- [0:37:26](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2246s) I mean, I spent 10 years on the road going to churches, um, for concerts. Um- [0:37:32](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2252s) I charged [0:37:32](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2252s) ... and they certainly charged. [0:37:33](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2253s) Really? [0:37:34](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2254s) So- [0:37:34](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2254s) Okay. Well, they don't in my area . [0:37:37](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2257s) Fair enough. [0:37:38](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2258s) They never have. I mean- Well, we're- ... Baptist, Methodists, some folks ... good Washington. [0:37:43](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2263s) Um, I guess what I'm getting to is like it kind of bifurcates types of music. So I, I travel with a, with a Christian musician named- [0:37:51](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2271s) Okay [0:37:52](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2272s) ... Chris Tomlin. [0:37:53](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2273s) Okay. [0:37:53](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2273s) And we would go into churches. So think, um, trying to think of a, a church that we would've been here in Atlanta. North Point Church in Alpharetta. [0:38:01](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2281s) Yeah. [0:38:01](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2281s) Um- [0:38:02](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2282s) Stanley Church. [0:38:04](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2284s) Yeah. Um, so in, in that scenario, those tickets would be taxed, but the next night if they're, if... And maybe it wouldn't if you called it a dance, right? I, I just- [0:38:15](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2295s) Well, they're Baptist. They probably don't call it a dance anyway. [0:38:16](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2296s) I, I know this isn't your original bill. Just, and I don't know how this is working. Yeah, exactly . Don't, don't tell Mike Griffin we're talking about that . Um, okay, so you would envision, you wouldn't have envisioned churches obviously 'cause you hadn't thought about that necessarily, but it would be captured, I guess, in some cases- [0:38:33](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2313s) Correct [0:38:33](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2313s) ... here as well. Okay. [0:38:39](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2319s) All right. Um, any other questions from the committee? [0:38:46](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2326s) All right. Uh, we can have a motion at the will of the committee, I guess. [0:38:52](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2332s) I move to pass. [0:38:54](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2334s) Second. [0:38:55](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2335s) LC 590274. [0:38:58](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2338s) We've got a motion, Senator Halpert, and, Halpern, and a second from Senator Cowsert. Any other discussion? All those in favor of this, raise your hand. One, two, three, four, five, six, seven opposed. All right. Seven... Wait a minute. I've got something wrong there, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten. Who was opposed? Raise your hand again. Two. Okay, I guess it was eight to two then. All right. Motion carries. [0:39:28](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2368s) And who's- [0:39:28](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2368s) Thank you, sir [0:39:28](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2368s) ... the Senate sponsor? I don't think it's Albers. [0:39:30](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2370s) Uh, I believe Senator Hickman. Senator Hickman, would you like to carry this? [0:39:34](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2374s) No. [0:39:34](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2374s) Okay. [0:39:39](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2379s) Thank you. [0:39:40](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2380s) Thanks. [0:39:40](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2380s) That'd be good. [0:39:41](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2381s) All right. So Representative Carpenter here. [0:39:44](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2384s) Hey. I always have such a good time in this committee. I'm glad to be here. [0:39:48](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2388s) Yeah. [0:39:49](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2389s) How we doing today, guys? [0:39:53](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2393s) We'll, we'll be the judge of that shortly. [0:39:56](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2396s) No question. [0:39:57](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2397s) We swear in Mr. Carpenter. [0:40:00](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2400s) Yeah, I don't tend to lie in here. [0:40:01](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2401s) All right. How much money you wanting to give away today? [0:40:03](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2403s) Got to come with my hands. What are we giving away today? House Bill, uh, 328, LC 59-0427S, I believe, is the substitute that you guys provided me with, which was a blessing, by the way. Normally, I get it when I walk in, so- [0:40:17](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2417s) Yeah [0:40:17](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2417s) ... I'm excited about that. I got to actually learn what I was lear- learn, learn a little bit today. So this is, uh, this bill addresses the SSO program. Uh, does a couple of things now as of today. It opens it up. Uh, it gives a waiver, uh, the six-week waiver, um, to, to be able to receive a scholarship to active duty military service children. Also, children with, uh, IEPs or Section 504s or individuals with dyslexia, autism, speech, language issues, hearing loss. [0:40:58](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2458s) That's the first thing it does, and then it goes to, I think, a part that's really important to you guys on line 93 And it just makes sure that no member of the General Assembly or spouse of the member of the General Assembly shall receive income from an SSO organization during the taxable year in which the organization receives a contribution, which I'm perfectly fine with. [0:41:28](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2488s) I think, uh, line 103 and 104 is just some cleanup language to make sure the process is done correctly. The big, the big piece is, uh, on line 117, is moving the cap from, uh, 120. It passed the House at 140, and you guys have decided to move it to two tw- 225, which is close to what has been subscribed, uh, the past few years. It's actually about 240, 240, 250 the last few years. It sets a percentage. [0:41:59](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2519s) Instead of having a, a base 6 million for the insurance premium tax liability, it sets it at 6%, so as the totals move over the years, it'll just move in correspondence with that. And then section six is, is a, um, is a different bill. I think, uh, Representative Townsend's bill on the PEACH credit, taking that cap to 25 million from 15, I believe. And so most of ... This, this program's been, uh, around a long time. [0:42:31](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2551s) I do believe it's one of the tax credits that saves the state money. Um, the average scholarship is around $4,700 versus we spend about $6,300 on average on QE, uh, funding for those children. So I do believe it saves the state money. You can make the argument that maybe these kids would never hit the public school, but the, the program itself requires them, except for these two, uh, exclusions, requires them to at- attend six weeks of a pre-K or a K through 12 school. [0:43:01](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2581s) There's al- I, I did, I did forget to cover one other thing. There is a, um, there is a cap on how much an individual student can receive through, through these scholarships. Uh, it's currently around $15,000 per kid, although the average is 4,700. This would waive that for kids, uh, with, uh, with certain disabilities. It would waive that cap, because we know that it, a lot of those kids would, uh, require more funding, uh, than your average student. [0:43:32](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2612s) I'll be glad to take any questions, thoughts. [0:43:35](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2615s) Right, and we've got, um, we've, we've got another one here that has a sunset on it, like we sunset everything in five years. It would basically be some of your bill. [0:43:44](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2624s) So is this the new ... This is the, this is my new version. I, I- [0:43:47](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2627s) Yeah [0:43:47](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2627s) ... I love this. [0:43:48](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2628s) Yeah. [0:43:49](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2629s) That's fine. No worries. It's your world. Um, learned that a long time ago. [0:43:53](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2633s) You know, we had, we had a study done on this, and it, and, and it indicated that, um, that less than half of these put somebody into the school if they were gonna be there anyway. So that, and there's some accountability issues, but I think it's something that probably the majority of this committee will wanna do. Um, I've, I've got- [0:44:12](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2652s) Yeah, I mean, it's your world [0:44:13](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2653s) ... I like the voucher program we put in better and the, and the federal program. I feel like there's more accountability in those, but that's just my personal opinion on it. Um, Senator Dolezal? [0:44:23](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2663s) Thank you, Chairman. Thank you, Representative. Um, is this the program that on the first day is fully subscribed? [0:44:31](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2671s) Every year. [0:44:31](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2671s) Like, by lunchtime? [0:44:32](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2672s) Every year. [0:44:33](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2673s) And when it's fully subscribed, then the process is to reduce the amount of funding that goes to the student by something like f- 53% they would lose? [0:44:43](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2683s) That's, that's right. 40- I think 47% a few years ago. It may have been even less than that this year. [0:44:48](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2688s) It- [0:44:48](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2688s) So, um, yeah. And, and, and I would argue that, um, uh, the results for me speak for themselves. We see it with the kids that are going to these schools. I see it firsthand at, at, at my kids attended a school that utilizes this program, and it brought kids to the school that would never be there. Over 50% of the kids are on scholarship at, like, $3,500 average. It just gives them enough that they can ... They, they've got s- it gives parents skin in the game. Uh, it saves the state money. I, I would argue that the, um, our other voucher program, which I do like as well, does not save the state. [0:45:21](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2721s) It's just right hand, left hand. This actually saves money. And, you know, you, you can talk about literacy rates. You can talk about college at- attendance rates. I think that, uh, the program kind of speaks for itself in that situation. [0:45:35](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2735s) If I could, Mr. Chairman. The language that you have on line 27 to 32, essentially, um, you are saying for students with a 504, an IEP, or those that have been diagnosed with dyslexia, you're not requiring them to trigger that six weeks- [0:45:50](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2750s) That's- [0:45:50](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2750s) ... in a school. You're allowing them to go to a school that perhaps is customized for them and their needs without having to kind of jump through that hoop of going through- [0:45:58](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2758s) That, that's right, and we do a lot of that with the military service, um, personnel. We do that with licensing to speed up the process, 'cause they're in and out a lot. And so sometimes that six week, or let's say it's a semester, 'cause most people are not gonna send their kids somewhere for six weeks then move them immediately. They'll roll through a whole semester. So it just, it speeds that process up. That is actually, uh, Bethany Ballard's bill, uh, but y'all m- married them. But, uh, I do think it's good policy. [0:46:27](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2787s) And Mr. Chairman, I also have my two cents on these two versions we have before us. You know, this is a, a credit that, as the representative said, we know saves the state money. Um, and typically, the, the sunsets that we've supported have been w- have usually been corporate tax credits with an eye towards evaluating the ROI to the state. This is not something we're doing with an eye towards an ROI to the state. Um, this is an investment in the students. So, um, at the appropriate time, Mr. Chairman, I'd like to make a motion to pass the version that does not have the sunset on it. [0:46:57](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2817s) All right. Senator Halpern? [0:47:03](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2823s) I ... What is my question? I have some concerns about the huge acceleration. I understand that this is more of a committee sub, but from 120 million to the 225 million Um, I do acknowledge that the students who are able to be able to go then to the private schools who may not otherwise be able to afford to go, so there is some value in that. I myself used to chair an independent school here in Atlanta, and we did use this program. [0:47:38](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2858s) Um, but it is ... Is it not still an offset though for, of monies that would otherwise be invested in other priorities, maybe even including education of our public schools- [0:47:54](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2874s) Yeah, I mean- [0:47:55](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2875s) ... and those students who are currently in the public schools and bolstering up the public schools so that they can provide the, the, whatever the children who are choosing to go to the privates would ordinarily need? [0:48:09](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2889s) Yeah, I mean, I think you can always make the argument that sure it would be great if we, if it, we fully funded QBE and gave them an additional $220 million. I think to me the argument is by allowing kids options, 'cause everybody doesn't fit in the same box, I think you have better outcomes for both sets. And to relieve some of the class sizes at the, in the public school while they're still keeping the public mon- the, the local money actually raises your per student spend in the, in, in the public school. [0:48:42](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2922s) So that, that, that's my argument. [0:48:44](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2924s) But you, would you agree that this is a different pot of 225 million on top of the pot of money that is going to vouchers, which is another kind of choice mechanism that the state is offering on top of other choice mechanisms, that the total amount ends up being far greater than just this one bucket of money for this particular program? [0:49:07](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2947s) Sure. So if, if the ... I, I think the, uh, the voucher number is, uh, 70 million, so we're, if this goes to 220, then that's $300 million. [0:49:17](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2957s) 300 million. [0:49:18](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2958s) And it pale like a dro- a drop in the bucket compared to, um, what we spend on QBE funding. And, you know, I'm a restaurant guy. [0:49:26](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2966s) That's right. [0:49:26](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2966s) I know you know that. Um, and you go out, I, I got, there's all kinds of restaurants. You know, we got choices when we go out to eat, and I think iron sharpens iron, and I think having those options is important because, you know, not everybody fits in those boxes. And it, I always love to see, um, you know, they had the kids here the other day, and you see mixed families, right? You got a kid that's in public school and then another kid that's in private school, and it, and it just, people see the value in having those options. [0:49:57](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2997s) And so I'm a big fan of options. [0:49:59](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=2999s) I mean, my, mine is a family that does options too. I, I will just underscore that I'm concerned about the acceleration to 225 million from the 120. [0:50:08](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3008s) Sh- sure, and I, and I think the conversation is, uh, it's always been in kind of $20 million increments, and we're coming every year, and everybody said, "Hey, let's just, let's get, let's get this, and let's, we don't have to bring it up every year." And so that's the reason I think for the, that and that it's subscribed so high. [0:50:26](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3026s) All right. Senator Gooch. [0:50:30](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3030s) Representative Carpenter, this is probably the best bill you've introduced this year, so thank you for bringing it to us. I'm not saying much about some of the others. [0:50:36](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3036s) I- I've got a lot of good ones, they just don't ever get over here. But I've got a lot of them. [0:50:40](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3040s) It's time, it is time for you to s- [0:50:40](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3040s) Anytime you want to sit down and go through my graveyard of legislation, we could have a- We'll have a fine time. [0:50:45](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3045s) The, the, the bridge from the House to the Senate must have collapsed on you this year, but, uh- [0:50:49](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3049s) It, it's, yeah, it's kind of like the, I don't know if you played Mario Kart ever growing up, Rainbow Road, where you fall off the side of the rainbow. [0:50:54](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3054s) There you go. [0:50:54](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3054s) That's what typically happens to my legislation. [0:50:56](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3056s) You may have mentioned this and I, I di- I did not hear it. So if it's fully subscribed by noon on the first day, what do you think the full demand would be? Does anyone have any records for that? [0:51:06](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3066s) I, I think that, I think that 240, 250 is a, is a good number. Obviously, as we continue to reduce the income tax, that's gonna slow down subscription as well. [0:51:14](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3074s) Sure. That's right. [0:51:15](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3075s) Um, I, you know, like anything else, I, I'd like to see it where it's not oversubscribed, so let's, how does that balance out, right? [0:51:22](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3082s) So that's, that is a good question. If the state income tax was eliminated tomorrow, would this program be gone? [0:51:28](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3088s) The, the, well, so you, you, hopefully you got the corporate side- [0:51:31](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3091s) Right [0:51:31](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3091s) ... and then you have the, uh, you have the insurance tax premium side as well. [0:51:36](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3096s) Right. [0:51:36](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3096s) So there are, there are avenues. But like anything, it'd be a struggle. There's a lot of individuals that c- that, uh, support this, so. [0:51:42](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3102s) And I like what you did on lines 93 through 96. We should probably add that to a lot of bills, but what was the, the origin of that line? [0:51:50](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3110s) That, that one, that didn't come from me. That came from the committee somewhere. [0:51:53](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3113s) Okay. [0:51:54](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3114s) But I'm, I'm fine with it. I don't have a problem with it. [0:51:55](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3115s) Yeah. No, I think we should add it to a lot of bills. [0:51:58](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3118s) Yeah. [0:51:58](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3118s) Thank you. [0:51:59](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3119s) Absolutely. [0:51:59](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3119s) Yeah. But I think any program where you said, "If we, if you donate $5,000, we'll give you $5,000," would be oversubscribed- [0:52:08](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3128s) Right [0:52:08](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3128s) ... no matter what you're doing it for, so. [0:52:10](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3130s) Yeah, I mean, I don't know. I mean, there's, there's, we got tax credits out there, fo- foster kid tax credits that do the same thing that aren't oversubscribed. People are real passionate about this tax credit. [0:52:19](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3139s) Yeah. Senator, uh, Anderson. [0:52:22](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3142s) Representative Carpenter, thank you for bringing this to us. What, um, how many children pr- currently have, uh, enrolled in this, and has the numbers increased? How much have the, the numbers increased, say, in the last three years? [0:52:40](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3160s) Uh, I'm, I'm thinking that it's around 20,000, and so it continues to go up as the dollar amounts increase. Um, the, the idea would be you take this to 220, it would add another 20,000 kids to, um, to receiving s- scholarships, partial scholarships. And you don't allow, we don't allow them to take both, right? You can't get this and the Promise Scholarship. It's either/or. So. [0:53:03](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3183s) So you, you would expect the enrollment to go up- [0:53:06](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3186s) Another, at least another 20,000 [0:53:07](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3187s) ... in the, in, in the next year? [0:53:09](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3189s) Or however long it takes to, to work its way through the system. [0:53:12](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3192s) Okay. [0:53:14](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3194s) And I, I believe somebody, we have a s- [0:53:18](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3198s) Yeah Matter of this f- You know, I didn't call him up, so don't come up yet. Oh, sorry, sorry. Oh, sorry. Uh, uh, sorry, in this committee, Casey doesn't say who comes up. That, that's the truth. [0:53:30](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3210s) Um- That's, uh- We've got, uh, first up, uh, Camille with, uh, Naughton with Christa Ray Atlanta. You can come on up. [0:53:41](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3221s) Come on in here. Glad to have you. [0:53:43](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3223s) Thank you, Mr. Chairman. So, um, my name is Camille Naughton, and I'm the president of Christa Ray Atlanta, um, High School here, about half a mile down the road. Um, we have 500 students. We are 9 through 12, and all of our students qualify for this. So this is extremely, extremely important to us. Our average household income for our families is $43,000 for a family of four. So all of our students are low income, and so our, we assess our parents. [0:54:14](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3254s) Our parents pay to come to Christa Ray, um, but they pay on average $750 a year. It costs us $20,000 a year to educate them, so you can see where this tax credit is essential to our success. You've seen it. Um, and so this to me, every year we sweat out January 1st. Um, we work really hard to gather as many donors as we can to, um, earmark their tax credits for us, and then we get a 53% proration. [0:54:51](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3291s) You know, this year a 47% prora- you know, we get a reduction by 53%. Um, and so I just wanna say as a user of this, it is, um, remarkable. 100% of our students are accepted into college every year, and I think, Senator Halpern, you mentioned ROI. We had our first college graduates in 2022. Since then, 51% of them have been hired by our corporate partners. Our school partners with 125 different companies in Atlanta, and these kids are getting jobs at Accenture and Deloitte and Delta Airlines and Coca-Cola. [0:55:30](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3330s) That is a game-changing employment for them and their families, so we're changing the trajectory of their lives. The ROI on this investment at Christa Ray, I can tell you, is exemplary, and then those kids are going on as financially independent taxpayers and contributors, too. Yes. So, um, one thing I wanted to say, too, just as the CEO of a school, um, I know that the sunset is important, but I wanna argue against that if possible. It is very difficult to plan how we will replace this money. [0:56:05](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3365s) This money makes up 30% of our operating budget, and it scares me every single session that it could go away. And so you're always playing this sort of, you c- it's very difficult to plan. [0:56:18](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3378s) And y- and I'll, I'll add, you guys have done a really good job over there, and I think you get more of the corporate- [0:56:24](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3384s) Mm-hmm [0:56:24](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3384s) ... tax credits, don't you? [0:56:26](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3386s) Not tax credits. The corporations- [0:56:27](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3387s) Um- [0:56:27](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3387s) ... actually just pay us. [0:56:28](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3388s) Yes. [0:56:29](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3389s) Mm-hmm. Yes. So 50% of our budget comes from the corporations. [0:56:32](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3392s) But I mean, they, they, they get money, they get part- [0:56:35](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3395s) Oh [0:56:35](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3395s) ... of this allocation. [0:56:36](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3396s) Oh, yes. So yes. I'm sorry. I understand your question. [0:56:39](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3399s) And, and, and, and they're limited to a certain amount, right? [0:56:41](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3401s) Mm-hmm. [0:56:41](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3401s) And, and what's that limit, sponsor of the bill? I'm sure you know all this. 10 gra- 10 grand. [0:56:47](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3407s) No. [0:56:47](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3407s) No, no. [0:56:48](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3408s) That's not his question. [0:56:49](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3409s) 75%. [0:56:50](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3410s) 75%. [0:56:50](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3410s) You have 75%. [0:56:52](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3412s) Mm-hmm. [0:56:53](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3413s) Of the tax. 75% of- Of the corporate tax. But I mean as far as a dollar amount of this- No, I don't think there's a dollar amount. Okay. I think it's a, a certain percentage. 75% of the corporate tax, yeah. Yeah. [0:57:04](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3424s) Yeah. [0:57:06](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3426s) Okay? [0:57:07](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3427s) Mm-hmm. [0:57:08](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3428s) All right. [0:57:09](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3429s) If it stays within the, within the cap, to her question. [0:57:13](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3433s) Mm-hmm. All right. Well, appreciate your testimony. [0:57:16](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3436s) Thank you. [0:57:19](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3439s) We've got, uh, Ben Sailor with Georgia GOAL. [0:57:25](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3445s) Yes, thank you, Mr. Chairman, committee members. Um, I'll, I'll keep this really brief. Um, I know our time is precious. Uh, my name is Ben Sailor. I'm the president and CEO of the Georgia GOAL Scholarship Program. We're the largest student scholarship program administering this tax credit here in the state of Georgia. Um, so we've had the pleasure for the last 17 years, 18 years now, seeing the impact of this, seeing thousands of students get on these scholarships and the lives that are changing. Um, I would echo, um, Camille's comments, um, related to sunset and trying to plan forward for students' futures. For a lot of these schools that are K through 12, they're admitting these kindergartners with a plan to provide scholarship for all 12 years that they're in school, um, which gives them a lot of hesitation and participation if there's a five-year sunset on the program. [0:58:07](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3487s) Um, so I would just ask and encourage all of you to consider the version of the bill without a five-year sunset while understanding the reason for having sunsets and reviewing tax credits and would encourage continued studies on our program and, and others and audits to make sure that it's still providing a great ROI on the state. Um, and we'd be happy to take any questions that anyone has. [0:58:23](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3503s) And the, the, the money that you guys get out of it, the percentage administrative cost is on a sliding scale, right? [0:58:30](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3510s) Yes, sir. Um, it's up to 8%. Um, Georgia GOAL has, um, since the beginning, only charged a 4% administrative fee, and in the last few years, we've actually found ways of providing rebates back to the schools, um, as we've been able to re- reduce our expenses on that as well. The, the nationwide average is a 10% allowed administrative fee. [0:58:47](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3527s) Well, I think Florida's at 3%, the last I looked at them. [0:58:50](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3530s) F- Florida, yes, sir. Uh, Florida also has about a $2 billion tax credit program with only two student scholarship organizations administering it, so their- [0:58:57](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3537s) Mm [0:58:57](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3537s) ... their scale has been able to grow to, to get that percentage down that low. Yes, sir. [0:59:01](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3541s) Okay, so you're doing it at 4% right now? [0:59:03](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3543s) Yes, sir. Yep. [0:59:04](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3544s) Okay. Senator Hickman, you got a question? [0:59:07](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3547s) Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um, if maybe go back to the lady before. [0:59:11](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3551s) Yes, sir. [0:59:11](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3551s) You know, the big, one of the big buzzwords up here this session has been for a while is literacy. [0:59:15](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3555s) Yes, sir. [0:59:16](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3556s) Do we have any kind of numbers on what the children or the students who, at your school, what grade level they're reading on or how proficient they are reading they are? I'm just curious. I mean, that, 'cause that's, if we putting, we putting $300 million in it, don't we all be getting something out of it. [0:59:31](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3571s) Yeah. Um, absolutely. When our students arrive at Christa Ray, on average, they are two years behind in both, uh, math and English, and by the time they graduate, they're college-ready. So we do a year and a half of curriculum every year that they're with us over those four years. [0:59:45](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3585s) And you, you have all those numbers- [0:59:47](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3587s) Yeah [0:59:47](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3587s) ... publicly available? [0:59:49](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3589s) Not publicly available, but privately available. I'm happy to send them to you. [0:59:52](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3592s) Now, so like in third grade reading level, what, what percentage of kids at third grade are reading on grade level? [0:59:56](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3596s) We don't. We're only high school and we won't take a student- [0:59:59](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3599s) Oh, high school. Okay. Okay. [0:59:59](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3599s) Yeah. We can't go back more than two years- [1:00:00](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3600s) Oh, well- [1:00:00](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3600s) ... 'cause we can't catch them up to read at- [1:00:02](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3602s) So what, what kids... You know, one, one of the things we've seen is across the state of Georgia, only about 45% of the students graduating are reading on 12th grade level. [1:00:11](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3611s) Mm-hmm. [1:00:12](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3612s) What percentage of your students graduate and are reading on grade level? [1:00:15](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3615s) Um, 85%. [1:00:17](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3617s) Can you share that with me, please? [1:00:18](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3618s) Yeah. Absolutely. [1:00:19](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3619s) Okay. Please. Thank you. [1:00:20](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3620s) And 85's a guess, but yeah- [1:00:21](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3621s) Thank you, Cheryl [1:00:21](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3621s) ... close. Okay. [1:00:23](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3623s) All right. We've got one more person, I believe. Um, where was there on the go? Let's see, 328. Yeah. Tripp Richardson here with Frontline. [1:00:45](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3645s) Thank you, Chairman and members of the committee. My name is Tripp Richardson with Frontline Policy, and we are here in support of HB 328 today. As Representative Carpenter already mentioned, this legislation strengthens Georgia Student Scholarship Organization program by expanding eligibility for certain students, including children of active duty military families and students with disabilities, such as those with IEPs or Section 504 plans. This bill also increases the tax credit cap for donations to scholarship organizations, allowing more private funding to support scholarships and provide families with additional educational opportunities. [1:01:20](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3680s) Frontline continues to fight for expansive school of choice, and HB 328 helps ensure more Georgia families have options when it comes to their children's education. We respectfully ask for favorable consideration of HB 328. Thank you. [1:01:34](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3694s) All right. Any questions from the committee? I don't see any. Thank you for your testimony. All right. We're back to the bill. I think everybody's spoken. Um- [1:01:44](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3704s) Make the motion, Mr. Chairman [1:01:45](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3705s) ... this, which, m- you got an LC number you're wanting to pass? There's, there was one with a sunset and one without. [1:01:53](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3713s) Sunset. [1:01:55](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3715s) Okay. We've got a motion- [1:01:56](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3716s) Second [1:01:56](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3716s) ... and a second by Senator Albers. Um, Senator Dolezal. [1:02:02](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3722s) Which bill do you have? [1:02:03](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3723s) He's, he made a motion on LC590431S, which w- which is the version with the sunset. I'd like to make a motion to strike line 125, which is the sunset. [1:02:13](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3733s) Second the motion. [1:02:14](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3734s) Okay. [1:02:16](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3736s) Sunset? Oh my goodness, no. [1:02:17](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3737s) We, we've got, we've got a motion, and now we've got an amendment, um, that's been seconded. Any other discussion? [1:02:25](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3745s) Yeah. I'll, I'll respond to the, um, the senator who wasn't recognized but wanted to opine. Um- [1:02:30](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3750s) To which senator are you responding? [1:02:31](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3751s) Ha- hang on. [1:02:32](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3752s) You. [1:02:32](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3752s) Let Senator Dolezal out. [1:02:33](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3753s) You. [1:02:33](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3753s) And then you can speak. [1:02:34](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3754s) You haven't called on him. [1:02:36](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3756s) So we, we just, we- [1:02:38](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3758s) How can you respond- [1:02:39](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3759s) We heard te- we heard testimony. I know it's, it'll be probably shocking for you and I to be on opposite ends of any issue, but, um, the, but in all seriousness, the, the certainty that these students need when they go into these programs, um, is critical. And we do not need to put the Senate in a posture of, without any action whatsoever, uh, by the General Assembly, this just automatically goes away completely in 2032. I think that the General Assembly at that time, most of us probably will not be here, needs to go on the record if they want to re- repeal this program. [1:03:12](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3792s) I do not believe that this program should go away, um, without the members of the General Assembly and the governor having to go on the record with their position on it. So that's why I made the motion I made. [1:03:22](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3802s) All right. Senator Roark, you're recognized now. [1:03:24](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3804s) Thank you, Mr. Chair. Uh, yeah, I, I, I don't, uh, the argument that, that a, a sunset, uh, gives uncertainty, uh, would mean that everything that we sunset, uh, un- uncertainty looms, and so we shouldn't have sunsets. Uh, uh, it's perfectly, uh, possible that the sunset get, uh, lifted a- and or mo- or moved, uh, a- a- as the time for its sunsetting, uh, approaches. [1:03:55](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3835s) That's commonplace, common practice of this committee, so I don't hear a strong argument for, uh, throwing the do- the doors open. [1:04:05](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3845s) All right. Senator Albers. [1:04:07](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3847s) Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate, uh, Senator Dolezal's thought process, but I have to agree that we sunset everything, and every person who's ever come for a tax credit to this committee always comes to the same thing. "Well, we need certainty. We need to continue on forever." But I think part of being good fiscal stewards here is we reanalyze this stuff. We keep remeasuring it. Uh, and that has proved us, uh, to find, uh, areas that we need to make adjustments over time. I'll go on record as saying I hope one day we have 100% school choice and none of this is needed. Um, but for right now, I think this is a good, sound policy to keep the sunset. [1:04:39](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3879s) Senator Gooch. [1:04:40](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3880s) Um, really just another comment, but to strike the sunset, in my opinion, gives certainty to the parents who have children in these schools. Otherwise, they don't know if this bill's gonna exist in five years or not. So if they have a, a, a kid in this program, and then two years later, the, the tax credit goes away and it's not renewed, then where does that put the child? So I would agree to get rid of the sunset, but I've seen this committee go back and forth on sunsets, one bill, no sunsets on the other. So it's just been kind of ironic to hear this discussion. [1:05:12](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3912s) But I would support the amendment to repeal the sunset on this bill, for sure. [1:05:17](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3917s) All right. Um, Senator Dolezal, I think you have the next comment. [1:05:20](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3920s) Close debate, I guess. I might, I might, I might actually. [1:05:22](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3922s) Let me, let me let- [1:05:23](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3923s) So- [1:05:23](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3923s) Let me let the other comments- [1:05:24](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3924s) No, I'll just, I'll just say what I want to say, and that, if that's okay. [1:05:26](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3926s) Okay. [1:05:26](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3926s) But I was joking about closing debate. Um- Th- this is not a business tax credit This is not a tax credit for people with- that want to repair a yacht, this is not a tax credit for people who want to make a movie, this is not a tax credit for people who want to do research and development. This is a tax credit for families to put their kids in an educational opportunity now w- with this expansion, kids with dyslexia, kids with IEPs and 504s. At Christo Rey, kids with first-generation college students, almost every single one of them. [1:05:58](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3958s) And this program has never had a tax credit, so the language was used, let's keep the ... or, sorry, has never had a sunset. [1:06:06](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3966s) Actually, it, it has in the past, but it was taken off the last time in conference committee- [1:06:11](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3971s) Mm-hmm [1:06:11](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3971s) ... the last time it passed out. [1:06:13](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3973s) It was taken out in conference committee, meaning it didn't pass. There have been efforts to do a sunset before, but there has never been a sunset in code on this program. [1:06:19](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3979s) I think there was one, and then it was taken out in a conference committee- [1:06:23](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3983s) I don't, I, I- [1:06:24](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3984s) ... uh, when it was up from, uh- [1:06:25](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3985s) Uh- [1:06:25](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3985s) The last time it was up. [1:06:26](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=3986s) Then let me rephrase. In my time in the general assembly, and that, that may be accurate what you're saying, this program has not had a sunset. There have been attempts to put sunsets on this program before. I think that if you think about a student who's a freshman in college, or, sorry, in high school in 2032, and we just let this thing go, you- it's a, it's very, very, very disruptive. It is far more disruptive than allowing some guy to repair his yacht and not pay sales tax. And so I think to compare this to other business tax credits is to, is to, I think you're beginning to really compare apples to oranges, um, in, in a way that I recognize the intent, but I would really c- ask this committee to consider the, the posture that- [1:07:11](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4031s) All right, I'm gonna let Senator Halpern go, and then that's, that's gonna be the last comment because everybody else has commented. [1:07:16](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4036s) Well, one, one point, uh, that you just made, Senator, and somebody can correct me if I'm wrong, but it's my understanding that once the school accepts you, they're not, they're not not accepting you back. The, the planning that schools do is, uh, is on a trajectory knowing how many students that they're gonna have, how many students they can accept. We're, uh, and so I don't know that it throws the families in limbo year by year not knowing that they're actually gonna be able to come back. And we're not sitting here today eliminating this SSO program at all. [1:07:50](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4070s) Um, but there can be some fluctuation, obviously, the more people subscribe. I think the other thing that we're presuming in this conversation that is fundamentally not true, um, and every school, including Christo Rey, who does a wonderful job with students, is that every school can accept, uh, a wider bandwidth. So we can talk about dyslexia, we can talk about IEPs and 404 programs, but the schools are determining, you know, kind of how much, uh, rubber band room they have to stretch in terms of the students they accept. [1:08:22](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4102s) And it's not as wide as I think we presume when we are in these conversations, um, generally. So just keep that in mind as well s- um, as we're debating this legislation. [1:08:35](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4115s) I don't see anymore. All right, well, everybody, uh, uh, I think- [1:08:39](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4119s) There's a point, Mr. Chairman, that hasn't been made. [1:08:40](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4120s) All right, I'll give you 30 seconds here. [1:08:42](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4122s) Thanks so much. Uh, uh, every parent with a child in school has got uncertainty. They're closing 16 schools, uh, in the Atlanta Public School System, uh, as we speak. That's uncertainty. You, you, you live with that. Uh, and, um, who's the teacher gonna be? You know, is the principal gonna stay the same? There are all sorts of, uh, uh, unpredictables that exist in this world, uh, around education. And so that, I just think that's a fallacious, uh, uh, argument- [1:09:10](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4150s) All right. Pre- [1:09:10](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4150s) ... in, in the face of all, all the uncertainties that parents deal with in education. [1:09:14](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4154s) All right. Appreciate the comments. We've got an amendment on the floor, uh, so we'll vote on, uh, we've had a motion, then we had an amendment on the floor. Um, all those, uh, in favor of the amendment, raise your hand. [1:09:29](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4169s) The amendment was to strike the sunset? [1:09:31](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4171s) Right. [1:09:32](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4172s) Right. Line 125, I believe. [1:09:34](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4174s) One, two, three, four, five. Chairman, can I make a quick comment? Well, we're in the middle of a vote right now. Okay. So, no. All right. Raise your hands again. Those are in favor of the amendment. One, two, three, four, five. Okay, those opposed. One, two, three, four, five, six. So the amendment has failed. We're back to the underlying bill. All in favor of the bill, raise your hand. All right, and one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight. [1:10:05](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4205s) Opposed? Three opposed. Motion carries. Who's your, uh, Senate sponsor? I think Shawn Still is carrying the bill, isn't he? Shawn Still, that sounds correct to me. Yeah. That's all today. Meeting adjourned. Thank you, sir. [1:10:17](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4217s) Thank you. [1:10:19](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4219s) Good job, Mr. Chair. [1:10:43](https://vimeo.com/1172712385#t=4243s) Thanks.