House Retirement Committee, March 30, 2026

Transcript

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1. 0:26:17

   Am I on? Okay. Folks, we're about to get started. We're just, uh, looking to get a quorum first. Just thank you for your patience.

2. 0:27:59

   Okay, folks, we're gonna go ahead and get started. Uh, I think we're almost there. Uh, just gonna recognize Chairman Tarvin real quick.

3. 0:28:05

   Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Shall we pray? Heavenly Father, we thank you for this day, and we ask that, uh, we look to you for guidance, and that may the decisions we make be what's best for the state of Georgia. In Christ's name we pray, amen.

4. 0:28:22

   Thanks, Steve. Okay. All right. We have-- I think we have quorum. We have, um, uh, six here in 506. We have, uh, Noel Williams and Mary Francis. Thank you, Mary Francis, for being on, on Zoom. I think we have one or two more members, uh, on their way. Uh, Senator Albers, you wanna come on up? I hope I'm not taking you from Senate rules.

5. 0:28:49

   No, no.

6. 0:28:49

   Okay, very good. Um, I appreciate you coming back. I know it's, uh, we're getting late in session. Uh, but if I could just take a, a point of, uh, of, uh, privilege for the Chairman. This is something that the House very much wanted to do, and I will say, if there's any delay, uh, it can be blamed on me. What I was doing is a tremendous amount of tax and legal due diligence. I wanna thank, uh, he's not listening right now, but Ed Emerson, attorney with Seyfarth Shaw, as well as Sam Choi with King & Spalding, because what I wanted to do, I wanted to do something for the firefighters to make a, a real impact.

7. 0:29:25

   Having said that, it took a quite a bit of due diligence on my mi-- on, on my, on my sep, 'cause I need to understand that this... I wanted to see proof that it wasn't a qualified plan, wasn't a 401, and it's not a RESA. It's, this is a supplemental benefit plan for the firefighters because, quite frankly, I don't, I don't know how they, you know, would get by and, and pay bills without it. But what I didn't wanna do was do anything that was gonna be controversial. Maybe not controversial. I didn't wanna do anything very substantially negative from a tax or a legal standpoint.

8. 0:29:59

   You know, early with-withdrawals, uh, not, not having a bona fide retirement, that doesn't apply here. And I will just tell you guys, I don't know if you've seen the substitute or what have you, but this does not have everything you want in it. Okay? It just, it, it doesn't. But what I am saying is this is the w- something that we, I think, pretty bold that we can do, and it, it will not have a break in service, and it will be near immediate, uh, and for the benefit of you and your families. So, with that, I wanna thank Mr., uh, Chairman Albers again coming back, and, uh, floor is yours, sir.

9. 0:30:33

   Thank you.

10. 0:30:35

    Oh.

11. 0:30:38

    Maybe I can give you the highlights.

12. 0:30:40

    Yeah.

13. 0:30:44

    Audits come in here that did put a paid handout for you all in the last meeting that, uh, we participated in together prior to, uh, Senate Bill 143, the authorization bill, uh, to help out the TRS for educators. And, uh, just wanted you all to be aware that the TRS is funded at 77.9%. Currently, the firefighter pension plan is at 7%, but that is actually a little bit wrong, because actuaries are saying that you're gonna get a pull-out every single year, and that does not necessarily happen with fire service.

14. 0:31:20

    The actual fair market value is 97%.

15. 0:31:23

    Now, if you look at what Senate Bill 143 will impact, it will have an actuary rate of 83%, but really a fair market value of 87%. Almost 10% higher than the TRS, for which has already been passed out of your fair committee here. So just to keep things in line, we love our educators. They play such a critical role in our state, but there is no way on God's green earth we'll ever compare to what a firefighter does over a 30 years time-

16. 0:31:50

    Yeah

17. 0:31:50

    ... to what a teacher does.

18. 0:31:51

    The risk of life is complete, and the, the, the physical toll on, physical toll on a firefighter versus other professions is without question.

19. 0:32:02

    Absolutely. Um, and I'm just looking through because I haven't seen your substitute yet.

20. 0:32:06

    And, and so, uh, I, I will just walk you through this, uh, Mr. Chairman, um, if, if, if I may. What, what this does is basically allow, uh, firefighters, um... And folks, just, uh, just for clarity, we're looking at LC5607-11S. Um, what this does, as you can see on lines, uh, 28, um, it should all be a requirement that a retired member terminate his or her employment or volunteer service to receive retirement benefits under this paragraph.

21. 0:32:37

    Basically, we're going back to the t- 55 years of age, um, uh, requirement. There also is a provision that we kept, uh, from y- uh, I think the r- the Senate Bill 143 has passed the Senate, and you see that on lines 41 in regard to someone who terminates after 15 years of service, uh, they would be eligible for a, a benefit. Um, and I just wanna stress that this, uh, the, the teachers, I, I, I take your point, Chairman, the teachers are required to have a one-year break in service, and they can only come back for specific areas of need.

22. 0:33:13

    I think we're still working on, uh, Senate Bill 150. I don't know if that's, uh, tr- crossed over. It has passed over on our house, uh, on our side. Um, that's the, the, the return to work, uh, that, uh, Chairman, uh, you know, Billy Hickman has been working on alongside, uh, Bethany Ballard fr- on our side. Um, that's basically the, uh, the main changes there. Um- I think most everything else is the same except for, uh, let's see.

23. 0:33:51

    If you go to section three, we have added one item, Chairman Albers, on, on page eight.

24. 0:33:58

    Yep.

25. 0:33:58

    Uh, this is nothing to do with the firefighters, but this is, uh, added language from House Bill 818.

26. 0:34:05

    Yeah.

27. 0:34:05

    And this has to do with, uh-

28. 0:34:07

    The fire

29. 0:34:07

    ... the, the tax court.

30. 0:34:09

    Yeah, that's it. That's

31. 0:34:09

    Uh-

32. 0:34:09

    ... what I planned

33. 0:34:10

    ... th- this, this has very minimal, uh, I think almost zero one year, first year impact. Uh, but this is for the recent member of VRS who transferred over to JRS based on, uh, an appointment j- just made just recently. Um, I, I just wanna stress and that, um, I, I think the House knew we need to do something for these men that are doing so much, uh, a- and in regard to... I thought I had a motion, sorry.

34. 0:34:40

    I think you said men and women.

35. 0:34:41

    Okay. Men and women, yes. Uh, i- in regard to not just the supplemental income, but also the sacrifice, recognizes the sacrifice these men and women are making. So, um, that's the, the essence of the changes. Um, we have a certification done, but I believe the actual investigation is being finalized. Is it not? Yes. Okay. Um, any questions from the g- does the author have any questions as a-

36. 0:35:10

    Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I, I appreciate your work on this. Uh, my, my only comment will be on changing it to 55, and I'm gonna tell you why it's different. Um, people in the fire service start younger. Uh, most people start, uh, when they are 18, 19 years old. Teachers typically don't start till they're 22 or 23 years old. So they start earlier, but the impact on a firefighter is the physical and mental toll on their bodies over 30 years. Uh, so to have someone start later and draw later might be a little different, but again, um, a teacher doesn't get woken up five times a night.

37. 0:35:42

    A teacher doesn't get exposed to carcinogens, doesn't have, uh, see the worst things in humanity happen in front of them, sometimes on a weekly basis. So, um, changing that to, uh, 55, to me it's a sliding scale because w- they're still gonna be there for 30 years.

38. 0:35:57

    Mm.

39. 0:35:57

    Uh, most people that enter the fire service do not do so with a college degree. A lot of them then do go on if they wanna get promoted, and will, while they're working, will do some type of a program to get an associate's, a bachelor's, or even higher. But when they start at 18 years old, that's why we move it to 50, because most people start right out of high school.

40. 0:36:14

    Okay. Understood. Um, I have a question. Will you let me know if I've got any questions online as well? I've got a question, number 26. Who's number 26? Chairman Martin.

41. 0:36:25

    That, that would be me. Uh, Chairman Parsons, I, I was just gonna, um, thank you for including 818 and, and remind the committee that that did pass out of here and pass on the House floor and-

42. 0:36:35

    Yes, it did. That is correct

43. 0:36:35

    ... is still awaiting over there. And, um, uh, I know that Mr Senator's added some things, but I was gonna move we, uh, move this on to Rules with due pass recommendation.

44. 0:36:46

    Thank you. Okay.

45. 0:36:47

    If, if you get ready to recognize my-

46. 0:36:49

    And I don't wanna, uh, skim past your comments. They are absolutely and duly, duly noted in regard to, um, yeah, average teacher, when she's, he or she, uh, when they retire at 60, they've have, what, uh, 32, 33 years of experience. Uh, a firefighter at age 55, I understand, probably has a few more, uh, a few more than that, I understand. Anything else from the committee or online? Patrick, you're watching that.

47. 0:37:20

    Okay. A couple people that have signed up, uh, if you could make it quick. Uh, Mr. Byrd, well, you and I spoke, uh, what was it, Friday afternoon that I bothered you?

48. 0:37:35

    I'm sorry.

49. 0:37:35

    It was not a bother, and I do appreciate you calling, by the way.

50. 0:37:37

    Absolutely.

51. 0:37:38

    That was very nice. Um, thank y'all all for your work in this, and thank you for putting forth due diligence, 'cause the last thing we'd want this to go through then have problems after the fact. So thank you, and I know you put a lot of your own time and money into that, so thank you for that.

52. 0:37:50

    Absolutely.

53. 0:37:50

    Uh, we are, uh, anticipating looking at the age at 55, and I can't overly reinforce that that is p- gonna put a toll on us. As I told you the last time, I have 52 and 53-year-olds that are just gonna go ahead and leave, because it's not g- it's not going to, they're not gonna wait till they're 55. So part of the purpose behind this was to try to maintain that experiential knowledge which is so vital in our operations. So 55, it may not keep as many in service as we'd hoped. Um, I would ask that, you know, any way to entertain maybe even a younger age between 50 and 55 is, uh...

54. 0:38:28

    But the big key is I also wanna make sure we don't bog this down to where it doesn't make it in this session.

55. 0:38:33

    Right.

56. 0:38:33

    So what is the, uh, with all these changes, is it gonna make it to the floor in this session, is my question for you.

57. 0:38:39

    If I have anything to say about it, this version as is is gonna make it to the floor hopefully tomorrow evening.

58. 0:38:46

    Any entertainment to lower it between 50 and 55 in discussion?

59. 0:38:49

    It, it would be tough to do so because of the, the, the redrafting, the recertification, the re, actuarial investigation.

60. 0:38:56

    Okay. Sounds, free time.

61. 0:38:57

    I appreciate it. Uh, Representative McDonald.

62. 0:39:03

    Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Committee. I, one, I just wanna thank you for coming back to the table for these guys. I mean, they've worked hard. I don't need to tell you my years of experience and, and I know I made a comparison to our higher ed chairman the other day for, in my, in my, uh, speech. And you know, there again, there's, there's, s- I still have some meat on the bone and could go back and do it today. It's just as, as the gentleman, the higher ed chair from, from up in the Roswell area, he can, Alpharetta, he can tell you that he could, you know, maybe not put on the pads, but he could go back and coach.

63. 0:39:33

    And that's important that we're out there in the, in the field, that we have those coaches out there to protect, and these younger guys. And, and that's, that's why these guys wanna get back and, after they retire from the bigger, bigger departments, go back to their small towns and, and participate. And I just wanna thank y'all for coming back to the table.

64. 0:39:49

    I appreciate that. And I, I, I did speak with Mr. Byrd, um, i- in regard to, uh, the potential, um, what you and I talked about, the potential for such young... I wouldn't say unqualified, but less experienced individuals going to life-threatening situations, and that's why we're moving something forward. I know it's not everything you want, I understand, but there's certain limitations I'm, I'm under. Um, any other thing else from the committee or online? Okay, I think we have a motion, uh, due pass.

65. 0:40:24

    I see 2607 running now.

66. 0:40:26

    Yes. I have a motion due pass. I have a second from somebody. Oh, Rep- uh, Chairman Tarvin. Any fur- DeLoach, okay. Any further discussion? All in favor say, "Aye."

67. 0:40:40

    Aye.

68. 0:40:40

    Any opp-

69. 0:40:42

    Aye.

70. 0:40:42

    Got two on, uh, online. Any oppose? Congratulations. Thank you, sir.

71. 0:40:47

    Try to get your John Hancock on this, uh, House rule-

72. 0:40:49

    Go ahead. It would be good to go ahead and get that now.

73. 0:40:52

    Well, you know, the rule was just announced on

74. 0:40:55

    Anybody second the motion?

75. 0:40:58

    They said it was 600.

76. 0:40:58

    Okay.

77. 0:40:59

    So I assumed they're gonna for the same motion.

78. 0:41:01

    No, they're not.

79. 0:41:01

    But still, it'll, it'll work its way through. It'll go down that way. And it'll go back and forth. It'll go John Howard's with those two rules, and it'll be combined at that time. It'll present that. By the time it goes back, it'll be, it'll, it'll, you know, it may not be on the first one, but it'll, it'll, it'll get more

80. 0:41:18

    ... We've got one more bill we wanna go ahead and, uh, hear. This is, uh,

81. 0:41:25

    Senate Bill 261.

82. 0:41:48

    Judge Murphy, good to see you.

83. 0:41:49

    Good to see you, Chairman. Thank you, sir.

84. 0:41:51

    Good morning.

85. 0:41:52

    Or afternoon.

86. 0:41:53

    Chairman, how are you doing?

87. 0:41:56

    I'm just having more fun, sir. We're getting all those bills. I think we, we got 80 or so, so, you know, what's w-

88. 0:42:03

    In rules?

89. 0:42:04

    They're out of rules. They pa- passed out of rules.

90. 0:42:06

    Oh, my gosh.

91. 0:42:07

    So-

92. 0:42:07

    Chairman Harvin, go ahead, sir.

93. 0:42:08

    Thank you, sir. Thank you, sir.

94. 0:42:10

    Do we have a, uh, do we get a, uh, the, the most recent draft to Chairman Harvin, please?

95. 0:42:15

    I've got notes on it.

96. 0:42:17

    Okay.

97. 0:42:17

    I've got notes on it as far as that. What I like about this bill more than anything, they're not asking us for any state money.

98. 0:42:23

    Right.

99. 0:42:23

    Uh, that's a good thing as far as that. The Magistrate Retirement Fund of Georgia has 200 members, 55 million in funds, and a funding ratio of 140%. It's a fully funded retirement plan that receives no state appropriation, is not requesting one, we need to hold them to that, and is not asking to raise any tack-on fees, which I think is a good thing. The bill is supported by the Board of Magistrate Retirement Fund of Georgia and by the Council of Magistrate Judge. It only seeks to make internal changes at, uh, the request of its members, and the Department of Audits and Accounts has certified that the changes can be made with the existing fund levels.

100. 0:43:01

     Uh, firf- four major changes, uh, in the bill are, uh, 47-25-20. It changes the composition of the board, um, from four chief magistrates who are members of the fund and one retired, uh, who is a member of the fund, instead of five chief magistrates who are members of the fund.

101. 0:43:19

     Right.

102. 0:43:19

     Two, it increases the membership dues from 4 point, excuse me, 3.42 to 4. It then in, uh, 347-25-81 changes the benefit multiplier from 4% to 5% in the final monthly calculation, and increases the, uh, number four, increases the cap of the benefit services from 20 years to t- uh, 28 years-

103. 0:43:42

     Okay

104. 0:43:42

     ... um, from that standpoint. Those, you, y'all made some of those changes, uh, from that standpoint.

105. 0:43:47

     We have.

106. 0:43:48

     And you tell me if I missed anything.

107. 0:43:49

     No, you were spot on. Uh, I, I think that, that... It makes it, uh, um, we're getting late in session, and it makes it, uh, simpler to pass, uh, and quicker. And, um, and so yeah, that, but you did a g- uh, excellent job. We do have the certification and investigation back on this bill. Cost came in a little bit less, and so I'm hoping w- this can make it to the floor quickly, um, 'cause I wanna get it over to, to you, Marty, uh, pretty soon. Um-

108. 0:44:17

     And you're carrying, correct?

109. 0:44:19

     If you would like me to, I will.

110. 0:44:21

     I would like you to.

111. 0:44:21

     Okay, very good. We're note-

112. 0:44:23

     With your, your influence, I think it could make it.

113. 0:44:25

     Hey, I'll do that for Judge Murphy. Judge, anything from you?

114. 0:44:29

     Yes, sir, just briefly. Good to see everybody. My name is Brendan Murphy. I serve as the chief magistrate judge in Cobb County. I'm also the vice chair of the Board of Commissioners of the Retirement Fund and our legislative chair. Just why now, essentially, when this fund, we're the newest judge fund, we're about 20 years old. When this fund was created, everybody took a very fiscally prudent, uh, response to make sure we'd have enough money without having to come down here and ask for state appropriations. We're funded by a tack on, a $3 tack on on civil cases filed in our class of court.

115. 0:45:01

     Well, uh, 20 years is here. Um, and so what this will allow, uh, our folks to do, those folks that have already been elected by their communities to continue serving beyond 20 years, they'll be able to continue to accrue a benefit, um, up until 28 years, an additional two terms. Uh, and then also allow us to accrue, um, at a rate of 5% instead of 4%, and that's to get us closer to where, uh, the probate judges are. The probate judges accrue at a rate of 5% a year, up to 30 years. And so again, when we were funded or founded 20 years ago, wanted to take a fiscally conservative approach, make sure the money would be there when the retirees were there.

116. 0:45:37

     And now that we've seen, um, that this funding model has been successful, our board has prudently managed, uh, these public funds, and so now we are asking for that benefit improvement.

117. 0:45:49

     Understand, sir. Thank you. Uh, we have one question. We didn't have any, uh, s- uh, speakers lined up. Vice Chairman Franklin?

118. 0:45:58

     Mr. Chairman, at, at the appropriate time, I'd like to motion the, the due pass for LC560697S

119. 0:46:05

     understood. Thank you. Number 26, Chairman Martin.

120. 0:46:09

     Yes, sir. Let me ask, uh, the, the chairman or His Honor there if he could do this. So on, on the, the section bill, section three, um, well first, first of all, thank the, the members for changing the percentage of the, the maximum, uh, co- uh, compensation under it. But any member who's approved for benefits and COSA shall be paid a, a monthly sum of up to 5% of, of their average monthly compensation.

121. 0:46:38

     So what we're climbing toward there is more than 100 per- you would retire on more than you're making.

122. 0:46:46

     Right. Um, thank you very much for that question, sir. And so the chart on page four, you know, from line 67 to 81, that's the original pay chart from 20 years ago.

123. 0:46:57

     Okay.

124. 0:46:57

     That's the state mandatory minimum salary.

125. 0:47:00

     Mm-hmm.

126. 0:47:00

     And so that was improved a few years ago, and so, but the 5% per year is still based on salaries from 20 years ago. So the reality is that folks are really being paid more than what is in this bill, so it makes it, even if you served 28 times 50, it's highly unlikely that you would be exceeding your salary.

127. 0:47:24

     Okay.

128. 0:47:25

     Uh, because this salary information that your retirement benefit is based on is 20 years old.

129. 0:47:32

     I- That, that's what I wanted to, to, to kinda go around. It's, it's hard to see what their actual retirement would be relative to their, their current salary, and we're too late in the session to get to that. But ideally it would've been better to probably fix that chart.

130. 0:47:46

     So-

131. 0:47:46

     But I won't belabor the point anymore.

132. 0:47:48

     Yes, sir. And I don't-

133. 0:47:49

     I, I, I understand why I was asking. I'm not gonna slow down, slow down your bill.

134. 0:47:52

     Okay.

135. 0:47:52

     That, that's what, uh... I thought I was reading that right, that you would actually be retiring on more than more than you were making to work there. And, and if these numbers were correct, that would be true, but they are out of date.

136. 0:48:03

     They are.

137. 0:48:04

     Fair enough.

138. 0:48:04

     I'll tell you my salary after the, after the hearing to make sure you see. That's right. That's right.

139. 0:48:12

     Good old Cobb County websites.

140. 0:48:14

     Yeah.

141. 0:48:14

     Like Mary Frances.

142. 0:48:15

     Yeah.

143. 0:48:18

     Okay. Very good. Um, I, I did wanna, uh, bring up two things, uh, that Judge Murphy, you and I talked about. How, how many members are in this plan? It's about 140 or...

144. 0:48:28

     It's, uh, div members, that's right. There are 159 chief magistrates eligible at any given time, but we have about 120, 130, and then total members, including retirees, are 200. We're such a young plan, we don't have many retirees yet.

145. 0:48:41

     It's a young plan, but there's a number of people that are right at that 20 plus mark, and that's why you wanted to go to that 28 years, correct?

146. 0:48:49

     That's correct. This is, this is a, you know, it's a two-year bill, and we will hit the 20-year mark this summer. And like I said, these are-

147. 0:48:55

     For a number of your judges.

148. 0:48:56

     That is correct. And a lot of them are watching right now. You know, our court is open 24 hours a day. We're kind of adjacent to public safety, right? When law enforcement is out in the streets, there needs to be a magistrate answering the phone, um, or the whole criminal justice system bogs down. So many of them wanted to join us today, but I told them, "You know, I'd drive down here, fight the Atlanta traffic." They stay at work.

149. 0:49:17

     I understand. Um, and the, the funded ratio of, of this plan is a lot different than it is than what we see for other plans. Uh, before this substitute, as of... I, I'm presuming this is as of June 30th of 2025, this 147% funded. After this substitute bill, again, we're working on LC560697. Uh, we're looking at 128% funded for the plan.

150. 0:49:49

     Any, uh, further discussion from the committee?

151. 0:49:51

     And the ta- Oh, I'm sorry. I'm jumping in on the-

152. 0:49:54

     Go ahead. Go ahead

153. 0:49:54

     ... and the tack on's on civil cases. So essentially the loser pays the tack on, right? The filer, the plaintiff files, and then the loser pays the court cost. Um, and so this isn't on criminal cases. It, it's not an increase. Um, it's an existing tack on.

154. 0:50:08

     Got it. Understood. I still have number 26. Did, did... Chuck, you had your question. Okay. All right, got it. Any further discussion from the committee? No, someone... No one, no one signed up to speak or online. Do I hear motion from the committee? We have, I think we had a due pass from Vice Chairman Franklin. Second from, uh, Chairman DeLoach. Any further discussion? All in favor say aye.

155. 0:50:33

     Aye.

156. 0:50:35

     Unanimous, including those on Zoom. Any opposed? Congratulations, sir.

157. 0:50:40

     Thank you.

158. 0:50:40

     Thank you very much.

159. 0:50:41

     Thank y'all.

160. 0:50:42

     Folks, we are adjourned for the year.