Comité Judiciary Juvenile de la Cámara de Representantes, 2 de marzo de 2026

Transcripción

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1. 0:21:28

   Good morning, everyone, and welcome to Judiciary Juvenile. There we go. Oh, my goodness gracious. Oh, okay. Hello. And we are in echo silence here. All right. So good morning, everyone. Welcome to Judiciary Juvenile. This is a very busy morning here at the Capitol. I appreciate all of you taking time out of your day to be here. We are here, um, to entertain a House Bill, House Bill 1429, brought to us by Representative Ballard. And Representative Ballard, whenever you're ready.

2. 0:21:55

   Thank you, Madam Chair, members of the committee. I have HB 1429, and, um, the LC number that we'll be dealing with, which should be on your phones right now, is LC48-1805S. And y'all are gonna have to, uh, excuse my voice this morning. With the beautiful warm weather has, has come allergies, which have gotten me. S or F? S.

3. 0:22:24

   It's on... It should be on your telephones.

4. 0:22:26

   Oh, I didn't remember. Yeah. Chairman Camp just, just sent that.

5. 0:22:31

   We're not as fancy as Ways and Means, but we're having to use our own phones.

6. 0:22:34

   Oh, wow.

7. 0:22:35

   Um, we appreciate, um, Holly Carter worked diligently this morning, and she got us up ready, but unfortunately, we didn't get it in time to put it in your folder, so. And Representative Draper was the smartest person in the room and realized that we had technology and we all have these phones. So please go ahead.

8. 0:22:50

   Okay. So, um, House Bill 1429, uh, seeks a small update to code that will provide clarity, transparency, and accountability as to what types of sentences, both monetary and non-monetary, are being imposed on our juvenile offenders. Currently, Georgia law requires juvenile offenders, um, to have information collected about age, race, sex, uh, disposition of the case, but not the amount of the fine, uh, the sentence that was actually imposed, or even if the money is actually collected.

9. 0:23:22

   Um, starting at line 23, um, well, it was line 23, not sure what line it is now. Um, I just don't have glasses. It looks like line 23 is now line 25. Nine twen- line 25. Um, you'll see this change. This bill will require the reporting of what sentence was imposed, the amount of mon- monetary fee or fine, and the collection of this money. This does not require any change in sentencing guidelines. We are not prescribing what a judge can or cannot do.

10. 0:23:56

    We just wanna see, um, what is happening and what is actually being, um, you know, put out there, assessed on our juvenile offenders, and what is coming in. Um, I, I think that this will be useful information as we, as we go forward, um, just to see what's happening in our juvenile justice system. Um, so it, that is the bill. If y'all, um... And the, the amendment language that we just got this morning was to just put us, um, in line with other language in other, uh, in other bills so that language is the same as far as collecting of data throughout the code.

11. 0:24:35

    We don't wanna have one reporting system over here and, and one for the, for this bill. So, um, I would love your favorable consideration, but I will take any questions.

12. 0:24:47

    All right. Thank you, Representative Ballard. And we certainly appreciate our friends at AOC, um, who weighed in on this bill and offered, um, some amendments, friendly amendments.

13. 0:24:55

    Friendli- very friendly.

14. 0:24:57

    Um, most definitely. We like, we like consistency in code. It makes things easier. And it looks like Representative Rice, or I'm sorry, Representative Taylor, do you have a question for the author?

15. 0:25:06

    I, I'm miss- I'm missing something. So can you explain the purpose of allo- i- identifying the exact amount of the fine? How does that benefit?

16. 0:25:20

    Um, well, in, in several states, um, and, and Texas and New Mexico come to mind, some states are actually spending more going after the fees and fines than they are collecting. Um, Texas, uh, 41 cents of every dollar of revenue from the fees and fines, um, so 41 cents of every dollar assessed is, is used to collect it. Um, New Mexico is spending $1.17 to get every dollar back.

17. 0:25:52

    Um, so I think that it will be beneficial to see how, you know, how this collection process is working. Um, I think that later on down the road, it might be, um, beneficial for us to see, um, if a fee or a fine, which is often paid by the parent and not the child, um, is affecting any, um, rate of reoccurrence. Um, you know, does a fine, you know, prevent a child from doing this again, or does some community service or some alternate sentence prevent them from, from doing it again?

18. 0:26:31

    So again, this does not change what we're asking our judges to do. It's not telling our judges, "You have to do this over this." This is just looking at what is being done and seeing how we can benefit our juveniles in the future.

19. 0:26:45

    And if I may, um, how are these, these c- funds, fees collected, how are they being used?

20. 0:26:51

    That's what we want to see. We, we have very little, um, transparency and, and, and data-

21. 0:26:59

    Yeah

22. 0:26:59

    ... on how things are actually being used. That's one of the things we want to look at.

23. 0:27:03

    In the court systems?

24. 0:27:04

    In the court system.

25. 0:27:05

    Wow.

26. 0:27:05

    So this would be a data collection, correct?

27. 0:27:06

    This is a data collection bill.

28. 0:27:08

    Well, thank you for the bill. That's very interesting. Thank you, Madam Chair.

29. 0:27:11

    Of course. Thank you so much for that question. All right. Um, I'm trying to figure, is it Representative Wade or is it Representative Draper? Please go ahead with your question for the bill's author.

30. 0:27:22

    Thank you, Madam Chair. Um, thank you for the bill. Um, data collection I think is a good idea, and, um, I have two thoughts on the bill. Uh, the first is perhaps two pieces of additional data that you might be interested in collecting and just proposed as, as a friendly consideration. Uh, so one is the court jurisdiction, so that we can do a comparison across court jurisdictions. You know, who's collecting what, and whether they're actually able to collect, and what the differences are b- amongst jurisdictions. Uh, and the second one is the age of the child, just given the differences between, you know, 12-year-olds and 17-year-olds, just y- if some are having better results than others, I think that would be valuable.

31. 0:27:57

    As long as we're collecting the data, it might be valuable to collect those as well. So, um- I would, I would accept that as a friendly amendment. Okay. All right. I think, I think those are excellent suggestions as well. Um, Ms. Carter, is there any way that we could add that later on? I think we're gonna do an amendment. Would that be a challenge to add the age and the jurisdiction? It will not as long as, uh, Madam Chair will give me the freedom to put things in grammatically and chronologically to keep things true with the legislation.

32. 0:28:28

    All right. I'm, I'm fine with that. Committee, are you good with that as well? Absolutely. All right. Wonderful. Thank you so much. I just- Great ... a second question if you don't mind. Of course. Go ahead. Um, so just, uh, just... I, I think there might be a disconnect between what you're saying the bill is and what is in lines 12 through 16. Um, so to me, it sounds like, Representative, what you're saying is this data will be collected upon final determination in a court, right? Like, final adjudication once the court case is closed, once there's a judgment.

33. 0:29:01

    Mm-hmm. That is when this data collection is triggered. Uh, when I read 12 through 15, that seems to me much broader, so it's talking about collect information for each child in need of services, delinquent child, whether they're accused of a felony offense, right? So it doesn't say anything about a conviction or, or, or a final determination of a court. So it just seems to be, uh, the, the, there's an ambiguity, I think, between what you're saying and what this lists here, and I wonder if there's a desire to narrow this to make it clear that this data collection proposition is only triggered after a court's final adjudication.

34. 0:29:36

    And I, I say that because I don't... I think, while I very much think that the data collection is beneficial, I don't wanna overburden the courts by making them think they have to collect data before it's actually useful. Okay. And I think, um, 12 through... Let's see. Um, 12 through 16 is the, uh, that was the amendment language that was offered up by the AOC. Who's that? I'm sorry, who's AO... By who, I'm sorry? The Administrative Office of the Courts. Office, courts. AOC. Okay. Yeah, because, um, we have the original bill, if you look in your folder.

35. 0:30:10

    Mm-hmm. Um, LC48-1778. Mm-hmm. Um, I don't know. I, I, and, and you know, and if that's the case, are they here by chance? I mean- Yes. Yes ... because they're talking about... Okay, maybe we can ask them, because you're talking about accused children as opposed to one that's actually been through the court process, and now we're talking about collection of fees and that type of thing. So it just seems much broader here in scope than what you relayed the bill to want to do. All right. So our, would our friend from AOC come up and share why this w- amendment was or why this substitution was made?

36. 0:30:44

    Okay. Representative Ballard, now the pollen's getting to me. I apologize. Sorry. All right. Please go ahead. Just tell us who you are and, um, what you do with the AOC and why this was brought about, please. Okay. Good morning, Committee. My name's Tracy Mason. I'm deputy director with the Administrative Office of the Courts, and we thank you for, uh, entertaining and accepting our suggestions. And as Representative Ballard said, this really was just to provide some consistency with other provisions in, uh, that code section and also with 15-11-64.1, and just based on our experience implementing, um, uh, other data elements that are submitted by juvenile court clerks through JDEX.

37. 0:31:20

    Um, so I don't have a copy of the sub in front of me, so I'm not sure if you are referring to the, um, the first part of subsection E or the in a form and format, uh- Yeah, it's the same. Uh, the first three lines seem to be the same, so starting at, uh, 12 in your copy. Okay. So- So that language that begins with, "Each clerk of the juvenile court shall collect," that language was in the existing bill, and it's also, um... It, that does appear in other, uh, provisions in the code section. So, um, so that was not an amendment that came from us, but that i- that is consistent with other areas where, um, that provides for data collection.

38. 0:32:01

    Um, Representative Draper, um, that provision is actually in current code. Even though it's underlined in this bill, it is actually in current code. Well,

39. 0:32:14

    that's interesting. Okay, so I mean, do you... Sure.

40. 0:32:27

    Representative Sharper, I have not forgotten about you. Hold on. Okay, that's fine. Where's the other amendment? I know we have this. Where's- W- I sent it on your phone. It was sent to you. It should be in your email. Yeah, I'll look. In your House email account. I'm looking for it, but- Okay. Okay, now I've got it. So if this is in... I'm sorry. No, go ahead. That's fine. If this is in current code, what your bill does is add additional data to be requested, or what, what is the change that your bill is making?

41. 0:33:04

    Um, so if you will look, it's the new line 25. Um- Okay ... uh, "Disposition of the case, including any monetary sanctions which may include but are not limited to fines, fees, court costs, and restitution. Uh, sentence imposed, including the type and amount of monetary sanctions, such as fines, court costs, and restitution, and the collection status of any monetary sanctions." Mm-hmm

42. 0:33:36

    Well, it's tough for me to understand without seeing the bigger context of the code section, but, um, I, I guess my point is, and I don't wanna delay things, but my point is

43. 0:33:50

    right now what is in code and right now what is in your bill is much broader, uh, than what you're s- the data you're saying you wanna collect. My understanding is you want the data collection to be triggered by the end of a proceeding. So like, okay, there's a fine or there's a, um, an order of some type and you wanna know whether or not the court is collecting or whether it's having a-

44. 0:34:16

    Yes

45. 0:34:16

    ... effect on the child not to come back, right? So it, it, it would, it would have to happen after the final adjudication as opposed to what it says now, which is a child can be accused of something.

46. 0:34:26

    Well, I, I think, um, reading the original code section, which has not been modified, each clerk-

47. 0:34:32

    Mm-hmm

48. 0:34:32

    ... the juvenile court shall collect the following information for each child in need of services, delinquent child, or child acu- accused of misdemeanor or felony offenses and shall provide this to administrative office courts by December 1st, um, such information and it lists it. Um, this is already being done.

49. 0:34:49

    Mm-hmm.

50. 0:34:50

    Um, and this has been done for a while. This is not new code section-

51. 0:34:53

    Mm-hmm

52. 0:34:53

    ... by any means, and the report is due to AOC by December 1st. So it's just a, a culmination of what has happened. So it would not be individual children, it would be a collective of children, and those are children who need services, um, a child who may be truant, and then either accused or, of a crime. Um, but a disposition, I guess there would not until there was a disposition, uh, I mean, someone strike me if I'm wrong, but, um-

53. 0:35:21

    Some of the data wouldn't be available

54. 0:35:23

    ... yeah, they wouldn't be available and there wouldn't be a fine or any other thing attached until there was a disposition, is my understanding.

55. 0:35:30

    And that's fine. I mean, and that's fine. And, and if, if we wanna collect that data... And, and by the way, this, this new one takes away that December 1st deadline. Um-

56. 0:35:38

    Oh. What is the new deadline now? Does it have a deadline?

57. 0:35:40

    Uh...

58. 0:35:41

    Yes.

59. 0:35:43

    All right. Legislative counsel, what's the new deadline? Is it also December 1st or is it another date?

60. 0:35:49

    It's December 1st, yeah. No. Not April.

61. 0:35:53

    Oh, April 15th. It's on your phone.

62. 0:35:55

    Yeah.

63. 0:35:55

    It's on your phone Rep- Representative Townsend, it's on your phone.

64. 0:35:58

    It's line 35. I'm sure it is. I apologize.

65. 0:36:00

    Line 35 on the newbie.

66. 0:36:02

    Yeah. Sorry. Line 34, the administrative office of the court shall compile all data collected pursuant to subsection E by April 15th, 2027 and annually thereafter.

67. 0:36:12

    Okay.

68. 0:36:13

    So it gives more flexibility.

69. 0:36:14

    Mm-hmm. It does. E- even though that is tax date. I guess it doesn't matter to the AOC.

70. 0:36:20

    Mm.

71. 0:36:21

    All right. Do you have any further questions, Representative Draper?

72. 0:36:26

    No, I don't. I, I think, I think the bill does something slightly different than what is being described, but that's okay if, if we, it... That's okay.

73. 0:36:34

    Okay. Okay. All right, thank you. Um, Representative Sharper.

74. 0:36:38

    All right, thank you so much. Um, now I'm, I'm listening and seeing, you know, everything here, and basically what we're saying that some of this stuff is already on the books.

75. 0:36:49

    Yeah.

76. 0:36:49

    Let's just say the big picture, okay? You may be involved in this as well. You have the big picture what they're already doing. Um, and one thing is the services even before the disposition, you're already gathering that information already. That's something, your data collection on that, that's already in play. All right, now we're focusing more on the financial side of this, of what we're doing. You know, is it a good thing for... I mean, now this is just I'm listening to you and you saying about the bill.

77. 0:37:23

    In that data collection, for one, we should already have these things. I mean, I mean, it just shows you that the government need to really tighten up in the whole, all agencies on technology and also data collection as a whole, and I'm glad we're moving in dir- that direction. But with that being said, now with you saying that we're looking at the money part, and if we are spending, uh, a lot of money, that's one part of it, okay? We're looking at the fi- finances now. I'm gonna show you a couple things.

78. 0:37:54

    We're looking at the money section to see is it worth it, are we spending too much money, it's not worth going to get the money 'cause we're spending too much to get it. On the second part is the child itself, and when we're doing this and we're looking at the juvenile system, the court system, um, the child is very, very important, and that's the one thing that we should do, is to make sure this child is being reformed and also taking responsibility. So what we're seeing is if the parent is responsible for this fine, but the child has no responsibility in the punishment on the fine end, then we're saying instead of making the parents pay it, we're gonna try to make two things happen here.

79. 0:38:41

    Relieve that parent of those financial obligations because they didn't do the crime, okay? So therefore, that can relieve them, and then we get with the child and do more of the community service. But I would like to see us do more community service rather than we're just gonna put them in jail. You know? So as I look at this whole thing, I wanna make sure we have the child forefront as being the, the main concern for that child's future and not just saying that we're spending too much money, let's forget ab- you know what I mean?

80. 0:39:18

    Let's just figure out something else.

81. 0:39:21

    Um, absolutely. Um, the child is always at the forefront, and I think the goal of our system should be to make sure that we are getting that child on the correct-

82. 0:39:35

    pathway that they need to be successful in their life. But I think, I think the bigger picture of the data collection is we don't quite know what's happening.

83. 0:39:45

    Mm-hmm.

84. 0:39:46

    And it would just be beneficial for us to see, um, all of this data collection or monetary data collection just across the board so that we can get a good picture of what is happening so that we can use that later to make informed decisions on how to best deal with our juvenile offenders and get them on a path to success.

85. 0:40:08

    Okay. And so at that point, once we get the data collection, and more than like you're gonna see that some of this burden shouldn't be on the parents anyway. I mean, I can already tell you in forefront that it's gonna have to fall back to the AOC and different ones to say, and the judicial system to say we're gonna do something different so that this child cannot repeat the offense because it's not coming out of their pocket, and that they need to be held accountable in a good way.

86. 0:40:34

    Yeah.

87. 0:40:34

    You know what I mean? So I appreciate that. And if we pass this bill and we go and get the data and get all these things done, then the Administrative Office of Courts and their partners will work on those findings and come up with a system that we probably won't have to come and do another bill, that they can do that in-house to say these are the things that we're gonna do to make sure that the kids are going to better direction and the state is saving money at the same time.

88. 0:41:02

    I h- I hope that, that our goal will, I'll, I think that that is, is their goal to make sure that our, our children are doing what they need to do and being, you know, rehabilitated and getting on that path.

89. 0:41:14

    Okay. Thank you so much.

90. 0:41:16

    Thank you, Representative Sharper. And Representative Taylor, do you have another question? We have a speaker. Do you wanna hear them first, or do you wanna go ahead with your question?

91. 0:41:23

    Well, I don't know. I don't know the speakers.

92. 0:41:25

    Okay. Well, I'm gonna let you go ahead with your question then. Please go ahead.

93. 0:41:27

    Thank you. Thank you, M- Madam Chair. Um, to my colleague, we just passed legislation that holds the parents accountable for the actions of their youth and their children. So, and I, I guess as a long run vision, we would have to do something with that law if you're gonna rehabilitate the whole system and the whole process. Is that something that you're working on? 'Cause I understand you clearly know that this is just data search. We wanna know what's going on with it, but I, as my colleague said, I really do think we need to address the underlying, even if we could do that simultaneously.

94. 0:42:00

    Because if we're collecting money and we still don't know where the money is going or how it's being used, and then if it's a burden on the parents, that's something that we should be doing simultaneously.

95. 0:42:10

    Well, I, I think, I'm gonna answer for you, Representative Allen, I think the most important thing for us to do at this point is not put the cart before the horse. Let's see, let's see what the process is, let's get this collected, and then if there's an issue, I, I certainly would support legislation that would resolve an issue, no matter who brings it, if there actually is an issue that needs to be addressed. Most definitely. Um, and I know firsthand that, um, I love data. I'm a data nerd. Um, if you guys don't know this about me, I love information, and I try never to, um, I try never to put salt in the well, I guess, so to speak.

96. 0:42:47

    I don't wanna ruin the information as it comes in. So I totally understand where you and Representative Sharper are going with this, and it could be an issue, and that's kinda why this was brought to be, but we don't know the resolution. So, um, I don't wanna propose legislation before we have some findings. But I s- I certainly appreciate both of you for that. If you wanna bring legislation, you're welcome to, um, but it's a very short runway until Friday.

97. 0:43:12

    I wasn't thinking that this session.

98. 0:43:13

    You are

99. 0:43:13

    Okay. So this is future. Yeah, let's, yeah, let's, let's see what's going here.

100. 0:43:16

     I, I think once we get this system going, um, I think it will be an ongoing conversation to, to make sure, again, that our state's children get, you know, even if they've started down a path that is not desirable, that we make sure we get them as best we can on a path for success in later life.

101. 0:43:38

     I just don't want the data collection to be five years out.

102. 0:43:42

     I get that.

103. 0:43:42

     Well, it's annually. So it's, it's gonna start next year. It's gonna start next year. It's annually. So, um, it will start April, I mean, a year from now it'll start. So we'll have some data by the time we're here in '28 for sure that we can review. So thank you. Thank you for that. All right, and we do have a speaker, Dr. Danielle Pilgrim. Are you here, just going up? I had an opportunity to meet Dr. Pilgrim, and we're gonna let her tell us a little bit about, um, her involvement in this. Please go ahead whenever you're ready.

104. 0:44:09

     Sure. Good morning to you all, Chairman Camp, mem- members of the committee. Thank you for the opportunity to speak today, um, and thank you for hearing this bill, Chairman Camp. My name is Dr. Danielle Pilgrim. I am the Director of Public Policy, uh, for the Deep Center, which is a non-profit organization located in Savannah, Georgia. Um, at the Deep Center, our mission is to empower, uplift, and support youth and their families so that they can thrive. Uh, we do our support through creative writing, arts, uh, publication, leadership development, and policy advocacy.

105. 0:44:42

     Uh, we work with hundreds of students in middle schools, high school students, as well as youth in the Juvenile Detention Center in Chatham County. And each year, we have the honor of watching our young people blossom through our programs and begin to see the possibilities, uh, the endless possibilities that they have. We wholeheartedly support this bill, um, strongly because it gives us the tools to better understand and quantify the experiences we are hearing directly from our youth and their families in our community. Um, as you all are aware, across the state, courts assess monetary sanctions on youth and families when a child is involved in the juvenile justice system.

106. 0:45:18

     However, there's no statewide requirement to track how much is assessed, how much is collected, or even how those funds are used. From experience, collecting comprehensive data across Georgia has been extremely challenging for our organization. Over the years, Deep Center, along with our partners, have submitted open records requests to superior courts in all 159 counties, seeking information about the use of fines and fees in juvenile d- delinquency cases and in criminal cases involving youth under 17. In many instances, we have not been successful.

107. 0:45:51

     Considering that the Georgia law already requires courts to report data on age, race, sex, and case outcomes, this bill, bill simply adds transparency around fines and fees by requiring reporting to AOC. This small change, although it's small, it provides clarity, transparency, and gives lawmakers, I believe, the ability to make informed decisions on the effectiveness and the fiscal soundness of our systems. Um, and this bill is simply about information.

108. 0:46:21

     And so I strongly, gently, uh, ask for your support of this bill. Thank you very much.

109. 0:46:28

     All right. Thank you, Dr. Pilgrim. Thank you for making the, the long trip of-

110. 0:46:31

     Right

111. 0:46:32

     ... for sure. Um, does anyone have a question for Dr. Pilgrim? All right, thank you. All right, so at this time, what's the will of the committee on House Bill 1429? Motion to pass. Motion to pass. Representative Sar- Amendment ... Saira Draper. Um, I'm sorry? Suggested amendment. Well, but we have to, we have to motion and second. We have an amendment. All right. And, um, first off, um, legislative council, we are working off of the substitute that you sent, which is LC481805S as in Sam.

112. 0:47:07

     Yes, you do.

113. 0:47:07

     Okay. All right. Verification from that from legislative council. All right, and, um, Representative Draper, I believe you have an amendment that you'd like to make to this substitute?

114. 0:47:16

     Uh, yes, I do. Uh, so I would move to amend the substitute to include after line 18, uh, subsection 2H, uh, and then, uh, to include after line 24 a new subsection 6, um,

115. 0:47:44

     I'll defer to legal counsel on this, but court jurisdiction.

116. 0:47:49

     Okay. All right, so we have the amending of line 18 with age, the word age, and then, um-

117. 0:47:59

     Sorry-

118. 0:48:00

     Oh

119. 0:48:00

     ... Madam Chair, af- after line 18, so it'd be the new line 19.

120. 0:48:03

     New line 19, okay.

121. 0:48:06

     Yes.

122. 0:48:06

     And then, um, you said after line 28?

123. 0:48:11

     After line 26. It'd be the l- new line 27.

124. 0:48:14

     Okay.

125. 0:48:15

     And it'd be-

126. 0:48:15

     And that's gonna be court jurisdiction.

127. 0:48:16

     Correct.

128. 0:48:17

     All right. So do we have a motion on this amendment? So moved. All right, we have a motion. Do we have second? Second? Okay, Representative Sharper. All right. All those in favor of the amendment to this bill, say aye. Aye. Any opposition? Okay. All right. So to the motion on the table, all those in favor of passing HB 1429, LC481805S as amended, say aye.

129. 0:48:49

     Aye. Any opposition? All right. Motion passes. Thank all of you so much. Meeting's adjourned. Have a wonderful day-

130. 0:48:56

     Thank you

131. 0:48:56

     ... and be safe. Thank you.

132. 0:48:56

     Thank you so much, Madam Chair.