Comité Finance del Senado, 23 de febrero de 2026

Transcripción

360 turnos. Seleccione un tiempo para reproducir ese momento del video.

1. 0:17:43

   Quorum here. We, I just left the health meeting that's got a few more minutes. It'll break up here shortly, and then we'll get a few more members. Then we'll have one that leaves. Or there's one coming from health right now. So, um, Senator Hickman, would you, uh, lead us in the invocation?

2. 0:17:58

   I will. Thank you, sir. Let us pray. Heavenly Father, you've giv- you've given us another great day, Heavenly Father, to honor you, and we ask you to please watch over us, Lord, as we, uh, review these bills. Lord, give us the wisdom, justice, and courage to do the right things for the people of Georgia. In your Son's name we pray. Amen.

3. 0:18:14

   Amen. So, um, Senator Echols, if you wanna come on up. Uh, Senator Echols has probably doubled my social calendar. Um, this is, this is part one of part two of the, uh, Lobbyist Employment Act that he's carrying this year.

4. 0:18:33

   Keep everybody busy working. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

5. 0:18:36

   Let me turn your mic on there. So we've got, um, Senate Bill 522, and, uh, let's see, you've got a substitute for this, I believe. Tell me the number of your substitute and make sure we all got the same one.

6. 0:18:52

   LC 590375S.

7. 0:18:56

   All right.

8. 0:18:58

   I appreciate that. I'm just walking job security for these people in the hallways.

9. 0:19:02

   Yeah.

10. 0:19:02

    Um, it's what I hear anyway. Um, I bring before you a bill, um, S- SB 522 today. Appreciate y'all taking the time to hear it. Uh, in the off-season, I was fortunate enough to car- to chair a study committee on tourism, and we traveled the state. We gained knowledge of industry needs, what other states are doing, and how tourism contributes to Georgia's economy and our way of life. Originally, I told industry folks that I'm very supportive of that industry.

11. 0:19:35

    Uh, I'm, I'm a farmer by trade, but also if you, um, if you come up and you see our parking lot, it's full of, uh, Floridians and North Carolinians. People from all over the, uh, the country really come to our farm, um, to, um, to, to have a on-farm experience or also just, just shop. But I also realize that when we go to Florida, when we go to some of our neighboring states, listen, we pay for their roads, we pay for their schools. Um, and, um, this is just, you know, one avenue to, to try to get some of that back.

12. 0:20:08

    And, um, our marketing efforts in the State of Georgia were, were, um, grossly underfunded as opposed to our neighboring states and the states all over the Southeast. Um, y'all also know, I don't have to tell y'all anything, that in our chamber we've been talking a lot about, uh, eliminating, uh, income tax. The House has talked about eliminating property tax. Um, we've actually voted that out of our chamber other day. This bill, um, it gives us, you know, a small mechanism to, to recoup some of that.

13. 0:20:39

    Um, Senate Bill 522 puts a $5 fee on rental cars. It's $5 a day. It exempts repairs, maintenance, and replacement. What we tried to do there is, um, it's unconstitutional to, to write the bill in such a way that it exempts Georgians. Um, but we're trying to catch, um, as few Georgians as, as possible adding that language in there. Um, we also put in there that, um, 20% of that money, uh, generated be, uh, designated, uh, subject to appropriations to tourism marketing, and that doesn't completely get us in line with other states, but it's a step in the right direction.

14. 0:21:25

    And I think the industry, um, would use that as a, a shot in the arm and as an incentive to push for more conventions and, and getting more visitors across Georgia, which hopefully results in more rental cars. Um, the fiscal note was pretty substantial here. Uh, it, uh, on the low end, it's estimated at $59 million, on the high end, 121 million. So, uh, so it's a lot of money. And exempting repairs, uh, maintenance, um, just add that we hope to capture the out-of-state revenue rather than hardworking Georgians who are renting a car out of necessity.

15. 0:22:06

    In 2015, uh, some of you guys were around here then, and, and, um, a hotel, a $5 fee on hotels passed. Um, uh, from some of you with the experience back then, y'all tell me it passed in the dead of night. Um, uh, if I did anything wrong in this process, I'm doing this way too early and not doing it in the dead of night. So, um, just trying to be upfront with everybody. You know, uh, in the industry, in the, in the hotel industry, I think there was a lot of, um, a lot of angst toward that $5 and, um, that nobody was ever gonna stay in a hotel again ever in the State of Georgia.

16. 0:22:45

    But that's not what happened. As a matter of fact, uh, in 2024, uh, that funding, that $5 raised, uh, $230 million, and all that money's dedicated toward DOT. So, you know, while this may hurt on the front end a little bit, I think that, um, in the, in the grand scheme, I think it's an opportunity for us to, you know, recoup some of what we spend, uh, when, when our folks go visit our neighboring states.

17. 0:23:17

    It's an opportunity to give back to the industry that, uh, does bring in, uh, $5 billion of, uh, of taxes a year into the State of Georgia. So with that, um, I'm happy to answer any questions.

18. 0:23:30

    All right. We've got a few people that wanna testify, and we're gonna try to give a little bit of time on there. But, uh, questions from the committee first. Senator Hodges.

19. 0:23:39

    Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you for bringing the bill. Um, Mr. Chairman, um, let me ask you two questions. One, what's the purpose of the bill?

20. 0:23:49

    Well, I, like I mentioned on the very, uh, front end of my comments that I, I did the study committee, and chaired the study committee, and, uh, Senator Halpern was, uh, on the committee with us. And I did it twofold. I, I did it because I love the industry, and I know what it brings into the state of Georgia and what it does for the, for the state. But also, I think we leave a lot on the table, uh, when it, w- when we're talking about-

21. 0:24:12

    Sure

22. 0:24:12

    ... other states and what they, what we're paying for in those other states. This bill right here-

23. 0:24:18

    Yeah

24. 0:24:18

    ... this does not put us in the top of rental car fees. Nowhere close to the top of rental car fees in the, uh, in the country. Um, as a matter of fact, it just kinda gets us in line with that.

25. 0:24:28

    So the purpose is to, is not to hurt rental cars. It's to, it's to help tourism, to bring more people here. And coming from a por- a part of the state that really relies on tourism, if the purpose is to promote tourism, why just 20%? Why not more?

26. 0:24:45

    Well, I also mentioned that I think, I think the industry... I, listen, I, if y'all wanna, if y'all wanna put an amendment on it to make it 80/20 the other way, we'll we can work on that. But no, I think the industry, um, it's hard to go make 'em whole, ma- make the industry whole and, and just get 'em in line with all our neighboring states and southeastern states just with a, with a snap of our fingers. But I think it, I think a bill like this incentivizes them to push for more conferences and conventions and get people here, uh, renting cars.

27. 0:25:15

    Well, uh, again, if the purpose is to help tourism, then, I mean, basically 80% of this money's going into the general fund. It does say at least, so I guess who would it be up to to decide that at least 20% or not 20%?

28. 0:25:32

    It's subject to appropriations.

29. 0:25:34

    Okay.

30. 0:25:34

    And, uh, and I think some of the, uh, talk is there's, there's not been a bill like this for the tourism industry-

31. 0:25:40

    So-

32. 0:25:40

    ... in at least 15 years, and I, I think this will-

33. 0:25:42

    So more could go in?

34. 0:25:43

    It could, absolutely.

35. 0:25:46

    Would you entertain a 50/50?

36. 0:25:52

    I would entertain it, but I think this may be uphill with the wind in my face as is.

37. 0:25:57

    Okay.

38. 0:25:57

    With all these statewide guys-

39. 0:25:58

    All right. I, I-

40. 0:25:58

    ... sitting in the room.

41. 0:26:00

    Okay. Thank you. I, I really, I, I, I really appreciate the effort to try to get our state to do more about tourism. It, it is our number two industry, and, and it's on the, it's on the incline, too. So I, I also think we should spend more money promoting this beautiful state we have, and I would like to see more of, than 20% of this, uh, go directly to that. Thank you.

42. 0:26:23

    And the, the author will tell you, I asked the same question of him. Um, but like he said, it is subject to appropriations. We had a problem with that with our scrap tire f- tire fee years ago just being used, though there was a time the state was desperate for money during the recession as well. But, um, we had a constitutional amendment to, to dedicate those fees that I was a part of. Senator Harbison, I think you were next.

43. 0:26:46

    Thank you, sir. Appreciate it. Thank you for bringing the bill. Question, as I read on line 13 and 14, it is, uh, that this does not apply to those vehicles that are for breakdown, repair, service damage, or loss. Is that correct? Is that someone would have to prove that this is, uh, basically an insurance claim or because your, because your car is in there for service? We're basically saying that if you are a part of Georgia, if you're a Georgian, we're not, we don't wanna charge you, but we're wanna charge those people who are outside of our state.

44. 0:27:18

    We're s-

45. 0:27:18

    If, am I-

46. 0:27:19

    Yes.

47. 0:27:20

    ... clarifying that?

48. 0:27:20

    Yes, sir, Mr. Yes, sir, Mr. Chairman. We, we're, uh, we're saying it without saying it.

49. 0:27:25

    You're saying it without saying it. We're, we wanna get even with our neighbors for charging us, so we're gonna charge them, right?

50. 0:27:30

    In some degree, yes, sir.

51. 0:27:31

    In some degree. Does this, would, uh, this also include, uh, programs like Turo, which where this would be that we have, if we have a citizen, he's also gonna pay that for his renting of the cars, things of that nature. That $5 is gonna be amended onto their bill, correct?

52. 0:27:49

    Uh, yes, and if you'll notice on, uh, line number 18 there, we, we, uh, that's one of the reasons that we brought the sub today, just to get some clarity right there. And, and in a lot of ways, Turo, uh, is kind of currently flying under the radar, so to speak, uh, when it comes to some of these taxes and, and fees that are implemented. Uh-

53. 0:28:11

    Do, do we think that we'll have any retaliatory actions by, uh, s- other states since we're gonna tax them, they're gonna come back and tax us? Is that any, have been even considered? Just curious.

54. 0:28:20

    Well, our Tennessee, South Carolina, and Florida are currently higher than us anyway, so.

55. 0:28:24

    They're charging a per day?

56. 0:28:26

    Uh, they're charging, their rate, their taxes and fees are higher than us.

57. 0:28:30

    Okay. Okie doke. Thank you, sir.

58. 0:28:32

    All right. Uh, Senator, uh, Dolezal, I believe you were next.

59. 0:28:36

    Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um, thank you, Chairman Echols, for bringing the bill. I just wanna clarify a question that Senator Hodges was asking. Uh, i- if you really wanted to dedicate these funds, it would need to be done constitutionally. And while it could be more than f- 20%, it could also be zero. Uh, if we pass this bill, none of this money could go to tourism, uh, without a constitutional amendment. Um, likewise, all of it could go , and we could put $50 million into tourism in the budget if we wanted to without passing this bill as well. So it's, it's really, I just wanna make sure that, and I know that I'm not informing every member of the committee, but just since it came up, I just wanna make sure that we recognize this is not a CA.

60. 0:29:13

    Uh, that really, that line in the bill has no force of law, um, to kind of force this money to go to tourism.

61. 0:29:21

    I, I understand. And Chairman and I spoke, um, to that, um, a couple times. And, um, uh, look, I, I think, um, political headwinds is something that we can, um, we can revisit later on and, and get a, I think it, it re- we refer to it as an order paragraph, um, on some of this legislation. But to get this more, um, palatable and try to get the ball moving in the right direction would-

62. 0:29:50

    Yeah, I know what you're doing. I just wanna make sure that for the committee that we-

63. 0:29:54

    Understand

64. 0:29:54

    ... that even if we change it to 50%, uh- Correct. It really has no f- it's, it's up to the future general assemblies-

65. 0:30:00

    Yeah

66. 0:30:00

    ... apart from a constitutional amendment.

67. 0:30:02

    Yes, sir.

68. 0:30:03

    Senator Halpern.

69. 0:30:05

    Thank you. Um, I, we just got this little card that kinda shows where Georgia sits in terms of its marketing dollars versus other states in the region and around the country, and obviously we're sitting at the bottom of the bars here at just 5.4 million. Will you remind me, please, um, what the return on investment is in tourism for every dollar that we speak, if you re- call?

70. 0:30:31

    Um, eight to $12 is the ROI, uh, for what we spend, uh, what a state spends, and that's pretty much, um, what you hear from all, from all over the country, not just here in Georgia. But it's pretty good return on investment. And the, and the beauty of it is it's near immediate. Uh, it's not like some tax credit that's 15, 20, 30 years out.

71. 0:30:55

    Thank you.

72. 0:30:55

    All right. Um,

73. 0:30:58

    we're gonna go on, uh, to the testimony then we can have more questions afterwards. Um-

74. 0:31:02

    Just could I make one just observation?

75. 0:31:04

    Sure.

76. 0:31:05

    If I look at the last, the lowest ones, the lowest ones have the best football teams, so must, something- ... must be tied to this, that the lower your fees-

77. 0:31:14

    All right

78. 0:31:14

    ... the better your team. I just wanted to make that observation.

79. 0:31:16

    Appreciate that. Um, we've got, um, uh, Jennings Hughes that wanted to testify. You wanna come up and have a seat?

80. 0:31:26

    Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

81. 0:31:26

    We're gonna, we're gonna need to le- I've got four people too on each side.

82. 0:31:30

    Real quick.

83. 0:31:30

    But I need to leave this just a couple of minutes.

84. 0:31:31

    Yes, sir.

85. 0:31:32

    Okay.

86. 0:31:32

    Uh, I'm Jennings Hughes. I represent GACVB, the State Convention & Visitors Bureau Association. Um, thank you Diego for passing our cards out. Y'all can see Georgia there at the bottom. Thank you Chairman Echols for the, the study committee this summer. Thank you, Senator Halpern. Um, we really, we had hundreds of people come out to these m- meetings. It was a great response. The tourism industry, there's nearly a half a million jobs of people that are either directly or indirectly working on tourism in the state. We love this bill.

87. 0:32:03

    Um, we like the idea of a fee with maybe some of the portion going to tourism. Maybe not. Um, a constitutional amendment would be more firm. But, uh, it's the number two industry in the state. We would like to see our marketing at the state level support the locals. Locals invest to bring people to their community, but we would like to see that overarching brand of Georgia tie all of that messaging together. Uh, like Chairman Echols said, there's a great ROI. Um, if you spend, you receive something in return.

88. 0:32:36

    When you market your own political campaigns, you see something in return. I think that, uh, if we were to market the state, we could see increased visitation, and then that cycle of revenue, tax revenue, it benefits everybody. So if y'all ever have any questions on tourism, I'd be happy to speak with any of, any of you. My name is Jennings Hughes. There is a state fee in Florida, in South Carolina, in Connecticut, in New Jersey, Massachusetts, Pennsylvania. There's a lot of different states that are taking money derived from rental cars and then directing it back to tourism in some capacity.

89. 0:33:12

    So we love this idea.

90. 0:33:15

    All right. We're gonna just do the testimony right now. Appreciate the testimony.

91. 0:33:20

    Thank you.

92. 0:33:20

    Um, let's go to the other side. I th- I've got Don Newton. Are you here to testify? We'll do back and forth.

93. 0:33:35

    Well, I guess we won't do back and forth 'cause here comes Heather, so- Oh, you mean we do tell our- So we'll give... No, no. Makes sense. You're gonna give them the last word, but that's okay. Oh, okay.

94. 0:33:42

    That's fine.

95. 0:33:43

    Afternoon. So my name's Don Newton. I'm the controller for Enterprise Rent-A-Car in Georgia. Uh, 522 dropped on Thursday, and I appreciate the opportunity to speak today at such short notice. Also, the time with, uh, Chairman Echols, we appreciate it today. So my goal is really to show how this bill would impact car rental and why the burden of this proposed fee will fall largely on Georgia residents and Georgia businesses. We've got over 120 locations in Georgia, and only a handful of airports. We employ over 1,500 people in the state with o- with over 1,200 of our neighborhood locations, i.e.

96. 0:34:14

    not at the airport. We operate over 110 neighborhood locations in Georgia, and the point I wanna make here is that firstly, car rental is primarily a local business. 75% of our business that we do in this state is not at the airport. It's at these neighborhood locations. Um, so I hope really this addresses the misconception that car rental is primarily out at the airport. It's in the home city, and it's in the neighborhoods for us. 91% of our business today at these 110 locations are to individuals with Georgia driver's licenses.

97. 0:34:49

    So these are Georgia residents renting cars from us at these 110-plus neighborhood locations. Therefore, the heavy burden of this $5 fee is gonna fall square in the lap of Georgia residents and Georgia businesses. 50% of our non-airport business is to, um, Georgia businesses and Georgia residents who simply need a car for transportation purposes. The other 50% relates to replacement-related rentals, which we talked about earlier on. We have thousands of local regular renters who rely on car rental and local communities for basic transportation, many in underserved communities who often struggle today to pay the deposit.

98. 0:35:27

    The other part about 522 is that it's, it's a regressive fee structure. That means that it hits local price-sensitive renters the hardest, given that it's a flat fee and not a percentage. And this fee will create a serious concern when it comes to affordability. On the commercial side, so our largest customers are Home Depot, UPS, Delta, Chick-fil-A, and the State of Georgia. This propo- proposed fee would cost each of them over $75,000 annually. The State of Georgia is our largest corporate customer, and we had over 150,000 rental days to the State of Georgia last year.

99. 0:36:06

    So based on that, this extra $5 fee would cost the state three-quarters of a million dollars annually, and that is growing. So the largest single burden of this proposed fee would likely be incurred by the state itself. So this effectively would shift money out of agency budgets without providing any operational benefit.

100. 0:36:30

     Need to wrap it up pretty quick.

101. 0:36:31

     Sure.

102. 0:36:31

     I got three other bills today.

103. 0:36:32

     I mean, I, I will talk also just about the fee structure that we have today in our business, which, um, at the n- neighborhood locations, it's around about 11%. You add an extra $5 on top of this, a neighborhood rental's gonna be around 20%. At the airport, the airport is, is crushed with additional fees, somewhere between 30 and 40% today. You add another five bucks to that, and it's gonna be around 50%. One real example I wanna show you is just the impact of an additional fee on our business. Um, last year, car rental revenues at the airport were back $20 million over 2024.

104. 0:37:08

     They were back $17 million from July through December. The reason that happened was because the airport increased the CFC from 5 to $8.50 a day. So that shows you the knock-on effect of an increase in the fee on our business, where our revenue dropped 17 million bucks. Um, really to finish, w- we think that, um, it's gonna have a negative impact in tourism business travel. It's gonna increase the cost of visiting Georgia. It's gonna reduce the competitiveness relative to neighboring states.

105. 0:37:39

     And i- i- it's really gonna place Atlanta already who's facing high rental costs at a disadvantage for convention and event planning. So a tourism fee that discourages tourism seems like it's counterproductive. So just to sum, the majority of the burden, we think, would fall on loc- local Georgia residents and Georgia businesses. It would cost Georgia's own state agencies over three-quarters of a million dollars a year. It would drive the total taxes-

106. 0:38:05

     All right, I need to... You're, you're repeating yourself.

107. 0:38:06

     Yep.

108. 0:38:06

     You already gave that. I need to stop at that point.

109. 0:38:08

     That's fine.

110. 0:38:09

     Um, you got anything you need to add?

111. 0:38:10

     Last thing. Um, in 2018, so when this was brought up in 2015, the laws were just a little bit different. In 2018, and this recently came to, to, into our hands today, about an hour ago. The FAA passed a, a reauthorization law, which really speaks to adding additional fees at the airport. So again, the airport has a big chunk of these days. That law states that if our airport is taking Airport Improvement Program funds, those, you can't add on another fee to that. So if you back out, those, all those airport days are essentially exempt from doing this because our airport's taking those funding dollars.

112. 0:38:47

     All you're looking at is the leftover home city days once you extrapolate all the re- the replacement-

113. 0:38:53

     Mm-hmm

114. 0:38:53

     ... maintenance, all of those. So this really comes back to that.

115. 0:38:55

     Well, I would, I would hope the fiscal note would've reflected that, but we can check and see.

116. 0:38:58

     Yes. So-

117. 0:38:58

     All right. We-

118. 0:38:59

     Anyway, um, wanted to add that in there because that was, that's a recent deal. You can also look up the, what happened in Colorado because there's some precedents there in regards to this.

119. 0:39:08

     Right, I know Colorado's had something.

120. 0:39:09

     Yep.

121. 0:39:10

     Okay, thanks for your testimony.

122. 0:39:11

     Thank you.

123. 0:39:12

     Um, we've got, uh, Chris, um, Hardman, I believe is how you say your name. You wanna come up and, again, try not to repeat what's been said, but tell us new information.

124. 0:39:24

     Well, uh, uh, thank you, Mr. Chairman. And in the interest of time, um, I've also got my good friend Michael Owens, who was also signed up to speak. Uh, he's the president of, uh, TLC, the Tourism Leadership Cr- Council. I'm Chris Hardman. I'm president and CEO of the Georgia Hotel & Lodging Association, and we are here to speak in strong support of Senate Bill 522. I wanna, I wanna begin by thanking our good friend and the, uh, Mr. Tourism his- himself, uh, Chairman Drew Echols, who brought this legislation because of the energy and the drive that he heard from the industry throughout this, this off-season during the Senate Study Committee on making Georgia the number one state for tourism.

125. 0:39:59

     But, uh, to Chairman Harbin's point, we do not wanna be last. Um, none of our football teams wanna be last. And actually, the creator of those graphs, uh, where Michael here, so I was hoping he could speak on some of that data and that statewide comparison. So Michael-

126. 0:40:12

     Yeah, so the-

127. 0:40:12

     ... turn it over to you

128. 0:40:13

     ... the, the, how much a state spends in, in ho- in marketing for tourism is often very difficult to understand. We spent weeks and weeks and weeks going through other states', um, appropriation sub- subcommittee appropriations to really understand what is the state spending on the brand, and that's what created that graph that was, that you see before you, um, after I, literally countless hours of research into our competitive states. What you won't see on there is Florida. Um, we chose not to put Florida on there 'cause we thought it was an intellectually dishonest conversation.

129. 0:40:43

     We don't have Disney World here. Um, we don't have that draw, um, in the state of Georgia, so we really wanted to talk about those states that we really are competing with. And I'll, I'll wrap up. I'm, I'm sympathetic with what the gentleman from the rental car, uh, company said. It's exactly what we said and what we were worried about 10 years ago when the hotel/motel fee, the $5 hotel/motel fee passed. Which by the way, the majority of the $5 hotel/motel fee paid in this state for 10 years is paid by Georgians. The number one customer for hotels in the state of Georgia are other Georgians. I would also point out that the roads that those rental cars rely on are subsidized by the hotels in that $5 hotel/motel fee.

130. 0:41:22

     And so to wrap up on his comments, we fully support Senate Bill 522. We thank Chairman Echols once again for bringing this forward, and we just want that regulatory fee to go back to the regulatory activity on which it was collected. That's tourism. So we can grow our return on investment so that dollar can turn into 8 to $12. So thank you, M- Mr. Chairman. We're happy to-

131. 0:41:40

     All right

132. 0:41:40

     ... stand or sit for any questions.

133. 0:41:42

     Th- thank you for your testimony. Um, this is gonna be a, a hearing only today, so um, we appreciate the testimony. Um, I need to hear from the members on how they feel.

134. 0:41:54

     Thank you.

135. 0:41:54

     We'll double check the fiscal note and, um-

136. 0:41:58

     Is there any opportunity to question? Excuse me. You want, Mr.

137. 0:42:02

     Owens

138. 0:42:02

     ... to, who, who are you wanting to question?

139. 0:42:04

     Uh, th- th- the

140. 0:42:07

     We heard testimony from Enterprise that-

141. 0:42:10

     Okay. Get your mic if you're gonna do that.

142. 0:42:12

     Oh, oh, I'm sorry. We heard, we heard testimony from Enterprise that, um, state agencies would be paying, that the s- that the state would be, uh, paying, uh, what was it? Three quarters of a million dollars a, a, a year. And I'd like to see that reflected in a fiscal note for the Lord's sake, if that's the case. One, one would think.

143. 0:42:38

     That's why I stated that we'll, we'll recheck the fiscal note-

144. 0:42:40

     Thank you, Mr. Chair

145. 0:42:40

     ... and see if it's in there. All right. Um, you can wrap up if you want to or you can wait for me to hear the will of the committee, whatever you wanna do.

146. 0:42:49

     I'll just, uh, a couple things.

147. 0:42:51

     Okay.

148. 0:42:52

     We did, uh, we spent a couple weeks, um, with Leg Council and Senate Research running that rabbit, um, as far as the airport's concerned. Um, and the way this is written, we feel pretty good about, um, about where we're at. And then I appreciate that comment, uh, Senator Orrock. Um, there's a lot of, uh, state employees that rent hotel, get hotel rooms, uh, across the State of Georgia, um, day in, day out, so that $5 fee applies to them.

149. 0:43:26

     But we'll be happy to try to get that, an accurate number for you as far as, uh, what state agencies are renting cars and, uh, yeah.

150. 0:43:37

     Senator Albers.

151. 0:43:37

     If I can clarify that, when, when anybody in state business travels, they can, uh, bring a tax-exempt form to not pay taxes, just for y'all to know. Thanks.

152. 0:43:45

     Thank you.

153. 0:43:46

     All right.

154. 0:43:46

     Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

155. 0:43:47

     Thank, thanks for the testimony. We'll, um, we'll, you know-

156. 0:43:51

     There are emergency business

157. 0:43:51

     ... committee members let me know your concerns, your feeling on this. We'll, we'll look at this in the future. All right. We're gonna go on to Senator Hickman's bill. You can do it down front or wherever you want to at.

158. 0:44:07

     You want to stand in the back?

159. 0:44:14

     Here.

160. 0:44:20

     Senator Gooch wants to give you some input.

161. 0:44:23

     Yeah. Before, before you leave and before the members of the c- of the audience leave, I think this tourism issue needs to really be addressed. I, I support comments that have been made about how important it is for our state. Uh, states like Michigan have really done a really good job promoting their state, and we see it on our televisions here. I don't know that we're doing much outside of Georgia. Obviously, we don't spend much to do it. But I believe we should make a commitment as a general assembly to, to help our state better in tourism.

162. 0:44:54

     But one idea I, I think we need to discuss is take existing revenues that we have today. If you look at a hotel bill when you check out of the hotels in Georgia, depends on which city you're in or which county you're in, the, the fees are exorbitant. They're up to 15% for hotel/motel tax, and then all the parking fees on top of that. It can be as much as $70 to $100 per night. I just think we've got the revenues there in the state funds and even the local funds. If we could come up with some kind of a matching grant program, take some of that existing sales tax money that's already being collected at that hotel/motel level, carve it out of the general fund, and then let the locals also pitch in, and, and we can promote j- tourism in Georgia.

163. 0:45:36

     And some of these cities that wanna participate can pitch in as well, just like we do LMIG money at GDOT. There's just gotta be some creativity. If we, if we don't pass this bill this year, and it sits another year, we need to be doing something to help promote tourism in Georgia. Well, visit, visit with Senator Echols and give him-

164. 0:45:51

     All right. Thank you

165. 0:45:52

     ... your thoughts and, and let me know from everybody. Um, I think Senator Gooch was trying to filibuster so your bill wouldn't hurt today. I don't, I don't, I don't know, but, uh, go ahead, Senator Hickman.

166. 0:46:03

     Well, I didn't, I didn't take it as that. I, I took that as very informative information. Thank you. Um, yes, sir. Thank you for... We're looking at Senate Bill 515, LC 49-25-55, and I've asked, uh, Kerry Prichard with the Department of Education to, um, inject if we need, if we need to. Um, first of all, thank you, Mr. Chairman and committee members for hearing this bill. I, I think we need to go back and digress and tell a little bit how we got to this point, and I think all y'all know how we got to this point. Um, it's called education, and it's, and it's called our children not being able to read.

167. 0:46:37

     Y'all know that the passion that the Senate has had over the last several years concerning our students not reading on grade level, and we continue to, to work to solve this problem. Y'all were gracious last year to pass Senate Resolution 237, which I say, I'm not, I'm a CPA. I'm not qualified to know why people don't wanna teach, and I don't know why people are getting out of teaching. But, but I, but I thought that, uh, Jody Barrow, Dr. Jody Barrow with Professional Standards would head up a group that would be made up of University System of Georgia, Technical College System of Georgia, Department of Education, State Board of Education, Student Finance, and others to get together in a room and, and break down the silos and, and, and find out, and help come up with some very informative suggestions of how we can get more people into the teaching profession and how we can m- how we can get people to stay in the teaching profession longer.

168. 0:47:30

     And they did that. They issued a great report, and I would encourage many of you to look at that if you haven't done it. I know our committee members have not only read, read some of it, but they've also, Dr. Barrow's done a presentation at our, at our, uh, meeting. So very detailed. Lot of suggestions. A lot of, lot of, uh, recommendations. I, I will say this. What's so impressive about this report, and you, and you, hopefully you will be impressed if you read it, read it, that, uh, I asked Dr. Barrow to tell me how many hours was spent in this report, putting this report together, in people hours. It was over 3,000 people hours.

169. 0:48:02

     It was, so it was very... We're taking education very, very seriously, and, and we know the Senate is taking it serious. Some of the things that came out of that report is, um- No student teacher pay. You know, we got interns in our office today. Every one of you got interns. We pay the interns. We don't pay student teachers a dime to either student teach or to travel. That's in the report. We had a da- data governance bill that we passed out of education a few days ago that will be, it should be heard on the floor in just, um, next few days. So the big literacy bill that's coming forward that, that Senate and the House passed, that, uh, pa- the, we've got, um, companion bills.

170. 0:48:38

     Um, that's a part of this, um, recommendation. And of course, chron- chronic absenteeism that, uh, Senator Dickens- Dickinson did such a great job on that bill in Education Committee last week. So all this is coming about, and all this is a, is, is an addition of why we're here today as and so forth. So just to give y'all a heads-up, you know, we got a huge teacher shortage in Georgia. Um, Jody Barrow says, uh, they do an annual survey, um, Doc- I started to say Dr. Albers. Excuse me. Chairman Albers.

171. 0:49:10

     Promotion.

172. 0:49:11

     Oh, Lord, I just really... Chairman Albers. They do a, they do a survey every, every year in December, and in December of '25, we had 5,358 vacancies in Georgia for teacher jobs. Now let me, let me bring that a little bit closer to my home. One of my home, um, communities is, uh, Evans County in Claxton, Georgia. They started out, according to Superintendent Brad Alexan- Brad Anderson, started out this year in, in August in K through five with six vacancies in K through five.

173. 0:49:42

     What did that mean? That meant he did not have a degreed teacher in a classroom K through five, six classes. Go a little bit further. I talked to Mr. Anderson two weeks ago, and he still had three vacancies in classrooms K, K through five in that school. So we've gone seven months, seven months in no, in those classrooms, there's not a degreed teacher in a classroom, a shortage of teachers, 5,358 across Georgia. One of my favorite quotes that, uh, Dr. Barrow u- used in the report was, "Educators on- are the only workforce whose performance determines the quality and size of all future workforces." He also goes, goes on to say, "Georgia cannot deliver on its commitment to students without a strong, stable educational workforce." So we all know if we don't have teachers in the classroom, our students will not be able to read.

174. 0:50:34

     We're currently under a bill, um, a House bill, um, teacher tax credit bill that, that will expire December this year, December of '26. So this, the, our, our bill is an intention to not only extend that, but also we have modified that bill some, and I'll tell you about that. Our bill, Senate Bill 515, uh, modifies the bill. The current bill is, is a $3,000 tax credit for yea- per year for five years for 1,000 educators, or a $3 million total.

175. 0:51:05

     We, we are not proposing to change that total. What we are proposing to look at, we've, we've, um, asked Austin Gibbons with Department of Revenue to look at it and see what the average tax credit is that's being used, um, under this bill. And in '22, the average tax credit was $2,294. '23, it was $2,486. In '24, it was $2,225. So, so the teachers that are qualifying for this tax credit are not using the total dollars available.

176. 0:51:35

     So what we're proposing is-

177. 0:51:38

     Let me turn my mic on here. So there is a 2,500 credit currently, right?

178. 0:51:43

     That's correct, sir.

179. 0:51:44

     And so they're, they're using about 2,300. One time I thought I heard you say 2,486-

180. 0:51:49

     I did

181. 0:51:49

     ... which pretty much-

182. 0:51:50

     I did

183. 0:51:50

     ... takes care of it, another one 2,200.

184. 0:51:52

     That's right.

185. 0:51:52

     So they're using at least 90% of it right now.

186. 0:51:55

     They're using, so what we would like to do in this bill, we would like to drop that amount down to, down to $2,500 and expand the people that will qualify. So-

187. 0:52:04

     So when you expand it, h- is it still have the $1,000 limit? I mean, 1,000-person limit?

188. 0:52:11

     No, it'll be 12. It'll be 1,250.

189. 0:52:13

     It'll be 12.

190. 0:52:13

     1,250.

191. 0:52:14

     12.

192. 0:52:14

     1,250.

193. 0:52:15

     Yes.

194. 0:52:15

     Okay.

195. 0:52:16

     1,250.

196. 0:52:16

     1,250.

197. 0:52:17

     It'll be 1,200.

198. 0:52:17

     So it'll go from, it'll, the credit will go from a $3,000 credit to a $2,500 credit.

199. 0:52:24

     Tell, tell everybody who you are. I know-

200. 0:52:26

     Oh, I'm sorry.

201. 0:52:26

     I know who you are since you worked for Lindsay Tiffin years ago, but-

202. 0:52:29

     Yes, sir.

203. 0:52:29

     Go ahead.

204. 0:52:29

     Um, Kerry Pritchard, uh, with the Department of Education. Um, so currently the credit is for $3,000 for 1,000 teachers that represent 100 schools. What the new bill will do is, um, change the tax credit to $2,500 for 1,250 teachers in, in specific subject areas from specific schools.

205. 0:52:59

     The credit will, the total dollar amount will, will remain the same.

206. 0:53:02

     Yes.

207. 0:53:02

     Okay.

208. 0:53:02

     Total dollar amount. Mm-hmm.

209. 0:53:03

     Total available credit amount will remain the same. So, so we're expanding, but we also, we, we changed a little bit of the way the, uh, the, the classes or the, um, the, the teachers that qualify. So in line seven-

210. 0:53:15

     So, so go, go through that. Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of lines taken out where you're changing, you're, you're opening it up. So can you kind of go through that sort of quickly? Or one of you.

211. 0:53:25

     What, why don't you do it, Kerry?

212. 0:53:26

     Do you want me to do it? Okay.

213. 0:53:27

     Yeah, please.

214. 0:53:28

     Okay. I'll just kind of go through, start on section, in section one, um, for the definitions. Uh, we've taken out the high-need subject area, participating local school, and participating schools. Um, what we did instead of it being high-need subject areas, we identified, um, the five kind of highest need areas, uh, statewide, which will be special education, math, uh, science, CTAE, and, um, ELA.

215. 0:53:59

     But with the ELA, you have to have, the teacher has to have a reading or a dyslexia endorsement in order to potentially qualify. Um-

216. 0:54:09

     And that is not in the current bill.

217. 0:54:11

     That is not in the current bill, correct. Um, so it also requires that the teacher has graduated from an EPP program, an educator prep program, in the State of Georgia at either a, um, USG institution or a private institution. Um, we have kind of re- on page three, um, made some changes to what constitutes a qualifying public school. The details are a little bit later on, but it basically opens it up to the lowest 25% of the schools in Georgia are the ones that are gonna qualify, um, as a qu- be a qualified public school.

218. 0:54:55

     Part of the reason why we did that, this is a retention to- or a recruitment tool more so than a retention tool for finding quality teachers. So regardless if it's a teacher that just graduated from a post-secondary institution or if it is a teacher that, um, is looking for a change from where they currently are, they have an option to go to one of these schools to be able to qualif- potentially qualify for the tax credit. Um, we took out the, the contract, um, for them to submit their school year contract.

219. 0:55:28

     They don't have to do that. We collect that. The department collects that information. We can verify their employment. Um, page four is where, um, we included grandfathering language as well as the 25, changing it from the 3,000 to the 2,500. Um, lines 80 through 82, um, ju- that just grandfathers the teachers that are now qualified for the program can continue to get the $3,000, um, but anybody after the '26 tax year, um, so next year's applicants, it'll be, um, the $2,500.

220. 0:56:08

     Okay.

221. 0:56:09

     Uh, I mentioned the qualifying public schools. Um, the department will, um, take the bottom 25% and determine, um, which 100 will qualify. Um-

222. 0:56:26

     100 schools.

223. 0:56:27

     Out of those, up to one, it'll be 100 schools. Um-

224. 0:56:32

     Now, when you, when you qualify for one of these, do you stay on it or do you have to qualify each year? How does that work?

225. 0:56:39

     So that is later on in the bill, but basically what it is, is as long as you stay employed at the school that you had applied for or you are involuntarily moved to another school-

226. 0:56:53

     Mm-hmm

227. 0:56:53

     ... you will continue to qualify for the five-year.

228. 0:56:57

     In the same district.

229. 0:56:58

     In the sa- it has to be in the same district. Um, the involuntary move, it has to be within the, the same district, um, but you have to stay within the, the same school that you were hired unless your school... Because the school system, teacher contracts are with the school system, not the school. So you could start the school year at, um, at Spalding Elementary School, and then halfway through you might get moved to Apple Valley just to, to, to-

230. 0:57:27

     Yeah, and, and one of the reasons I was asking that is your, your sunset on line 191's a little bit longer than we like to do things. We-

231. 0:57:35

     That's right.

232. 0:57:35

     We, we kinda got burned on one dealing with the data centers already that-

233. 0:57:39

     And we recommended. Yeah, we recognized that and-

234. 0:57:40

     ... that got 10 years past our vote.

235. 0:57:41

     Yeah.

236. 0:57:41

     But the question along with that, um, is that, so on that sunset, if you're already qualified, do you continue on, if you qualify in '34, do you continue on for five years?

237. 0:57:52

     Yes.

238. 0:57:53

     So that it really goes to thir- to '30, 2039 then.

239. 0:57:57

     Yeah.

240. 0:57:57

     So we gotta visit that. That's one of the issues we'll need to visit.

241. 0:58:00

     Yeah.

242. 0:58:00

     Okay.

243. 0:58:00

     And, and, and we're open to that. We're open to that.

244. 0:58:02

     Okay.

245. 0:58:02

     Mm-hmm.

246. 0:58:03

     Um, Senator Albers, you had a question. Go ahead this time.

247. 0:58:07

     Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Just got a few questions. First, Carey, great to see you. Thank you for all your hard work, and, uh, Senator Hickman, uh, your passion for education and literacy is just unmatched. Thank you for what you're doing.

248. 0:58:16

     Thank you.

249. 0:58:17

     Uh, just a couple quick questions. Uh, I realize that we're keeping the dollars the same, and they're pretty straightforward, but I think because it still will impact past the date, we would need a fiscal note for this bill. Is that not true, Mr. Chairman?

250. 0:58:29

     We've requested one. We don't have it yet.

251. 0:58:31

     Okay. All right. Uh, and then, uh, you already mentioned, uh, the, the part about the sunset on line 191. Uh, you mentioned the issue we have with having a non-degreed teacher in some of your classrooms, and I know we have that in other areas of the state as well. Uh, my question would be, maybe it's a comment/question, is, you know, as the world has changed away from that, and I always use examples. You know, Larry Ellison was either the number one or num- number two richest man in the world, but he can't teach second grade math in Georgia.

252. 0:59:02

     Bill Gates can't teach computers in Georgia. Billy Joel can't teach music in Georgia. Now arguably, these are the three greatest on their planet for everything they ever did, but they lack a college degree to do that. So are we willing to be a little more creative and truly look at people's life experiences in order to fill those important gaps as opposed to just a piece of paper?

253. 0:59:28

     Well, in my understanding, um, Senator Setzler is working on a bill that will allow people like that to come ba- come into the system and teach.

254. 0:59:37

     And we, we do have-

255. 0:59:38

     That's right, yeah.

256. 0:59:39

     All but one school system in the State of Georgia has a performance contract with the state, whether it's strategic waiver or a charter system.

257. 0:59:46

     Oh, okay.

258. 0:59:47

     Um, and we allow flexibility with certification and focus. We allow districts to make their determination of wor- real-world experience. So, you know, Chairman Hickman is a CPA. We have a financial literacy requirement, and we have economics classes that, or an economics class that is a graduation requirement Senator Hickman could potentially qualify to go work at a school system to teach that class.

259. 1:00:19

     So there are-

260. 1:00:19

     That's because he has a college degree. What about someone who did not complete their degree, like the three folks I mentioned earlier?

261. 1:00:27

     Th- there's, that's more of a PSC question, but it is something to look at, and I, and I see and understand where you're coming from.

262. 1:00:38

     Yeah, I mean, my, my, my-

263. 1:00:39

     Yeah

264. 1:00:39

     ... my numbers are probably three or four years out of date, but the last time I checked, the top 25 most wealthy, successful people in this world-

265. 1:00:45

     Mm-hmm

266. 1:00:45

     ... less than half of them had a college degree.

267. 1:00:47

     Yeah.

268. 1:00:47

     And so if we're just basing things only on that and not on their God-given experience and things they're done, I think this helps fill the gaps. And, you know, we're constantly looking for one more incentive, one more incentive, one more incentive, right? I don't know if we always get to the root of the problem. Um, and I would actually be, I'd be more open to looking at a performance-based bonus system than, than trying to do something off of their taxes all the time.

269. 1:01:08

     Mm-hmm.

270. 1:01:09

     Uh, because it just creates yet another issue we have in our tax code.

271. 1:01:12

     Mm-hmm.

272. 1:01:13

     So I just wanted to know if we could look at some different options potentially, um, as opposed to just always hounding on a carrot, 'cause we have added, what, about $9,000 in teacher raises in the last eight years, I think.

273. 1:01:23

     Mm-hmm.

274. 1:01:25

     Mr. Chairman, you, you mentioned about the, uh, fiscal note. Is that because of the 20, uh, the 34-day or that-

275. 1:01:30

     Well, I need to, I need to see what their interpretation is of how long it goes out. That's part of the-

276. 1:01:35

     Mm-hmm

277. 1:01:35

     ... the need for it, is it looks to me from when I'm reading this, it goes through 2039. So we need to get the fiscal note, and we need to look at the sunset before we move forward on this. Um-

278. 1:01:47

     Well, you know, obviously I, without being, yeah, we'd like to have this pass this session if we could.

279. 1:01:52

     Right. I, I understand that. We've got time, but we do have to get those, those, uh, questions answered. I requested the fiscal note-

280. 1:01:59

     And-

281. 1:02:00

     ... pretty much the time you gave me the bill.

282. 1:02:01

     And, and we, we would definitely be amenable to the five-year versus 10-year if you like that.

283. 1:02:05

     Okay.

284. 1:02:05

     Mm-hmm.

285. 1:02:06

     All right, great. Senator Anderson, we got a couple more bills after this.

286. 1:02:09

     Yep.

287. 1:02:09

     And we're only gonna hear it today, so at-

288. 1:02:11

     Real brief

289. 1:02:11

     ... some point I need to move on.

290. 1:02:13

     Real brief, um, Chairman Hickman, thank you for your passion for our children. Um, you say right now currently it's 1,000 teachers and you want to go to 1,250.

291. 1:02:28

     Yes, sir. Yes, sir. That would qualify.

292. 1:02:30

     Do, do we have 1,000 people, 1,000 teachers this now?

293. 1:02:37

     Yeah, I, if you want the numbers.

294. 1:02:39

     Right now, there are people taking the credit right now, yeah.

295. 1:02:42

     Yeah. Yeah.

296. 1:02:42

     I mean, is it-

297. 1:02:43

     That, that, that's obviously one of the-

298. 1:02:44

     Oh, do we have a-

299. 1:02:45

     That, that, that's obviously, Mr. Chairman, one of our big issues right now is, and, and that's why we're working so hard with the college and universities to get these people to make teaching the profession that it was at one time, Doctor.

300. 1:02:55

     So we have 1,000 teachers that have-

301. 1:02:59

     That would be a question. That is a, don't know the-

302. 1:03:01

     Would-

303. 1:03:01

     I don't know the answer to that question.

304. 1:03:02

     Well, get us the answer before the next meeting-

305. 1:03:04

     Yeah

306. 1:03:05

     ... if you would-

307. 1:03:05

     Yeah

308. 1:03:05

     ... for, for Senator Anderson. Senator Orrock.

309. 1:03:08

     Thank you. Uh, uh, thank you for your bill, uh, Senator Hickman. And I, I, I would just point out, isn't it true that the sooner we can provide financial aid that's needs-based for people to enter college and seek degrees, that is a critical way to address the workforce shortage in the teaching, uh, profession for Georgia? It's a direct, it's a direct link. There are people that cannot go to college now because of, uh, their, the, their, their financial need, and the sooner we start putting in a financial aid that's needs-based, we get, we're filling the pipeline with people that can be trained to be teachers.

310. 1:03:58

     Isn't that, isn't that a direct link?

311. 1:03:59

     I think the senator has passion- ... but we do have the, those with a B average have the Zell Miller as well, so.

312. 1:04:05

     Oh, no, that only-

313. 1:04:06

     We, we've got-

314. 1:04:06

     That doesn't pay for the, uh, non-tuition things. Uh, no.

315. 1:04:09

     It was for, for tuition and the, the majority of the cost, right.

316. 1:04:12

     Yeah. Yeah.

317. 1:04:13

     Okay. Um, we're gonna probably need to stop at this point, get to a couple of more bills.

318. 1:04:18

     Okay.

319. 1:04:19

     I think you, we've got several things we still need to get.

320. 1:04:21

     Okay.

321. 1:04:22

     Um, what Senator Anderson wants, look at the sunset and the fiscal note, but-

322. 1:04:26

     That'd be fine.

323. 1:04:27

     I appreciate-

324. 1:04:27

     And actually, we'd be, we'd be more than happy to agree with that.

325. 1:04:30

     All right.

326. 1:04:30

     We also, we also, Mr. Chairman, on the very last page of-

327. 1:04:32

     So did you put it in there and hope we didn't catch it or what? So.

328. 1:04:35

     No. No. I would never under- underestimate the intelligence of the chairman.

329. 1:04:40

     No. Oh, now, now he's pandering.

330. 1:04:44

     But, but on page nine, we need to change that date to January 1 of 2027.

331. 1:04:48

     All right. Well, we, uh, we appreciate-

332. 1:04:50

     Thank you, sir

333. 1:04:51

     ... the, the presentation. Great to see you again.

334. 1:04:53

     Yes, sir.

335. 1:04:54

     Carrie, and I know you're, uh, you're quite a numbers guru-

336. 1:04:58

     Thank you, sir

337. 1:04:58

     ... on your own. Exceeding my knowledge of QBE, I know that. Well, probably one of the six or seven people in the state that understands QBE, I think, so.

338. 1:05:07

     Don't, don't give away my secrets.

339. 1:05:12

     All right, um, did we lose, uh, Senator Roberson?

340. 1:05:16

     He walked out. He's upset that you didn't call him up earlier, so he left.

341. 1:05:21

     Oh, did he? Okay.

342. 1:05:23

     He may be

343. 1:05:46

     outside.

344. 1:05:47

     We added him on. Yeah, well-

345. 1:05:49

     He did leave. Yeah, we all witnessed it.

346. 1:05:50

     He's just stepping outside the door.

347. 1:05:51

     He left.

348. 1:05:51

     He seemed to be concerned.

349. 1:05:52

     Uh, pretty, pretty quick here. Oh, we're, we're getting more folks.

350. 1:06:02

     I'm ready to make a motion. We're not there yet.

351. 1:06:15

     I'll make the motion then.

352. 1:07:00

     All right. Well let's, let's talk about this bill anyway, one of his, even though he's abandoned the committee. Senate Bill 306, I believe we passed this out last year, and it was one of those that was, uh, in rules on the last day that didn't get called up when, when time ran out. Anybody have any-

353. 1:07:22

     Wouldn't that be a substitute bill for the rules?

354. 1:07:25

     Um-

355. 1:07:26

     So does that leave for Judy in seven minutes.

356. 1:07:28

     I think it, I th- Okay. I think it is a, um, I think it's a different LC number 'cause they're making us doing it, do it that way. But the, the language is the same.

357. 1:07:39

     If you need me, I'll be here too.

358. 1:07:50

     He's got two bills here, yeah.

359. 1:07:52

     I think we're gonna be able to hear them in seven minutes.

360. 1:07:55

     So, um, we, we, we filibustered as long as we can. I'm not sure what happened. Maybe he had a 4:00 meeting, I don't know. But we'll adjourn the meeting. Thank y'all for being here.